Delco price list hurting the industry,

There Is No Need For It !!!!!!!

Ron Musgraves said:
Ok, maybe we should do it by state…LOL

Guys it’s a baseline, the current list is bad.

This is not a debate about price fixing or anything else.
It’s to help Robert at Delco Change a list that been there and that is going to be there better.

I have pricelist online for customers, pricelist have not been bad and help me get business easy. Customers I have can often estimate there own jobs.

This list is a baseline, each and every business person around the country knows there own numbers. They should use it as a guide and not fact.
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Then why would that business person need a pricing base line? THEY DON'T BECAUSE THEY KNOW THEIR NUMBERS.

The "Low Baller" is the only guy that will benefit from this list. The only way to eliminate low ballers is to eliminate the "easy in" for them . . . Give out a price list and its a sure fire way of creating more low ballers. Pricing is a key part of the market research area of a business plan. Your not supposed to start a business over night! People should have to do their home work and figure out their numbers. Every one hates when a new guy comes on the board and the first question he ask is how much should i charge. What is the difference in giving out a "price baseline" ? hell your answering a question before its even asked!!!

I just think this is a BAD IDEA!!! and it goes back to my original question? Why is it even in existence? what good does it do?

Ron your pricing has been covered a MILLION TIMES!!! You price on volume work! You live in Phoenix where you can clean year round, and you have a million places to get work . . . in other area of the US its not like that

Basic business tells us that there is two models to go by

Low price high volume
High price low volume

I can only wash about 8 months out of the year some guys less than that, so for us to do a full years worth of work in that time frame means we have to charge more. Look at theme parks, you go on vacation to one of these and a hot dog cost $5 its partially because that park is only open from april to sept. they still have bills in the winter just like any one else so they make up for it by charging more when they are open.

Personally, I don't want a price list from the west coast or from down south, or from a volume priced company in my area. Make the hacks get serious or get out, don't give them a price list for your area and them let them come to my area and try to kill the market.


I stand that this is a bad thing and should be removed all together !
 
Russ Spence said:
DJ that is all fine and good and I love it when that happens just like the next guy but take from me and my experience I GUARANTEE you will make more money if you find your niche and stick to it and devolip a baseline price for your service. We have done that and I swear I dont know where I would be today if I had learned it sooner, probably on a cruise some where checking my accounts !

My personal oponion is this, nevermind looks like you have decided who you want to model your business after. Good luck, if you are headed in the direction it appears you will need it, few make it that way but on another note some are successful I hope you will be one too.
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Russ i fully understand having a price list for YOUR OWN COMPANY

Hell I have em
<a href="http://s86.photobucket.com/albums/k101/dccowboy32/?action=view&current=IMG_0178.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k101/dccowboy32/IMG_0178.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

As far as a niche is concerned, i have found what i feel is my niche, Property "maintenance" if you will, I have talk to many customers, resi and comm. and the idea of having one go to company eases their mind a little.

I haven't modeled my company after any one, if you were referring to Mike and Ken they have helped me out tremendously on resi work, but what i very seldom say is that Squirt gun has helped me on the commercial side of work more than any one. I just don't say it that often because I know it will cause people to bug the hell out of him.

My business model is exactly that, my business model, its is a combo of every one that has helped me, even you Russ! :)
 
Ron Musgraves said:
Russ, I heading to KY. his crews are making alittle under what mine make a week. 16,000...

Based on those numbers i'm all in. thats 832,000 a year per crew. My ears and eyes are wide open.

I'm looking online for a home in KY.
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Sorry ron but i missed where i posted that i make that every day? because i don't and i will openly say that. I made 400 and worked for 4 hours, see your business model would blow if you was a solo op, if it could even exist. You tell people your price but what they don't understand is that crap won't work for a solo run company, and you never seem to tell them that! I just got your voice mail and I didn't answer because i honestly don't feel like talking to you! It has gotten to the point where i see that you are one person one second and some one else the next. You ask me to speak in MB then tell me i don't know pricing a month later. Your two faced and your always trying to get some one else on your side! I'm over your political BS! I'm me today tomorrow and two weeks from now. And thats the only kind of people i want to be associated with!
 
DJ Carroll said:
Sorry ron but i missed where i posted that i make that every day? because i don't and i will openly say that. I made 400 and worked for 4 hours, see your business model would blow if you was a solo op, if it could even exist. You tell people your price but what they don't understand is that crap won't work for a solo run company, and you never seem to tell them that! I just got your voice mail and I didn't answer because i honestly don't feel like talking to you! It has gotten to the point where i see that you are one person one second and some one else the next. You ask me to speak in MB then tell me i don't know pricing a month later. Your two faced and your always trying to get some one else on your side! I'm over your political BS! I'm me today tomorrow and two weeks from now. And thats the only kind of people i want to be associated with!
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LOL,

It’s kind of funny you say I have a personality problem. I have never spoken badly about you anywhere. If you have, please point me to the liar that said I said you’re a fool.

On the contrary I have spoken highly of you to all. If you think me asking you to stay out of pricing help for a national pricelist and that offended you? Please…you have been in business a few months and called everyone I know every time you needed a price. LOL

Dj, I once called you a diamond in the ruff. Trust me you won’t hear me talking about you. (anything)
I will discount this conversation as you’re young and inexperienced.
If you no longer want to be friends as you stated, please don’t call me and ask advice. The window is closed……


No hard feelings….Keep it real.
 
Ron Musgraves said:
Scrappy, Please dont e-mail him. You dont know about pricing.
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I aplogize to Dj for being to frank. I should have e-mailed this to him and left my opionion out of public eye.

So I'm sorry you got so upset. I just thought we were better friends. my mistake...
 
DJ Carroll said:
Sorry ron but i missed where i posted that i make that every day? because i don't and i will openly say that. I made 400 and worked for 4 hours, see your business model would blow if you was a solo op, if it could even exist. You tell people your price but what they don't understand is that crap won't work for a solo run company, and you never seem to tell them that! I just got your voice mail and I didn't answer because i honestly don't feel like talking to you! It has gotten to the point where i see that you are one person one second and some one else the next. You ask me to speak in MB then tell me i don't know pricing a month later. Your two faced and your always trying to get some one else on your side! I'm over your political BS! I'm me today tomorrow and two weeks from now. And thats the only kind of people i want to be associated with!
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Gee I found Ron to be anything but two faced, some times he is so blunt it hurts to read or hear.

I hear volume all the time and I find its funny.

I am all for companies getting what they can, but I will tell you I know there are many companies that do close to or over 1 million a year and they all do one form or another of commercial work.

Maybe they are all wrong and price low price high volume. I know I rather be doing that million mark than chasing 10-50 $200, $400, $500 estimates all over place all week. I found I can't stand doing resi estimates, but you do have to start somewhere.

I dont think you understand, maybe you do. All the time spent chasing low dollar jobs or resi work is time spent and it takes money out of your pocket. Now with one call many can get a $5000, $10,000, $25,000 $100,000 dollar contract. I like to dream big then think big. The wave of the future is large scale contracts. Hell its on the stock market. Look at REIT's real estate investment trust they run much of the country and they hire commercial cleaners. I go after the big dogs the big jobs in PM resi work. is it volume? call it what you want its money in my pocket darn good money. I still have a lot to learn too, I'm learning all the time

Good luck with your niche, You say one man operations I just thought you wanted to be more than that. I know many who do property maintenance ( A very close Friend of mine does about 2 mill a year)they do well, but you know something they also have what you would call volume pricing, you'll figure that out sooner or later. I

Oh ya like I said in the email to you brother, Ron has always talked good about you to me and others that were around. Just thoughtI would mention that. Political BS, no I just call it straight bul*sh*t.

I don't even know why I am doing all this babbling, maybe I'm just standing up for my freind & industry leader Ron, just thought I would share what I thought. Oh well I spend to much time on these BB's

I Love PWing
 
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Jeff you are correct (I actually agree with a freakin democrat..... go figure ?) I see no way to make a million dollars by my self with a pressure washer ! (not in a year anyway) I too like to think BIG like Jeff, THAT IS HOW WE MAKE MONEY !

Funny I had people laugh at my prices from time to time, funny but I am always on the go go go, productivity breeds productivity. 4 trailers in the yard look good BUT they are not making money in the yard are they ?

Lets see I tried to use Delco when I first found the price list in 1998 ! Hell I almost worked myself to death for a few months, I then tried to go back to residential thinking that is where the money is.......... WRONG ! I SEE NOW, Several guys 3 or more years ago started opening my eyes to commercial flatwork, I tried to price a few local jobs at those rates and wow I thought ... NO WAY I CAN MAKE MONEY! Then I started to open my eyes after I saw it start to build a little , pretty soon I realized I had checks coming when some guys were whining looking for a house or worse a driveway to wash. Now we are scheduling for PM's in 2010, in fact we just got thru scheduling 72 shopping centers for 2009 and 2010 ..... 4 times a year ! That is 288 jobs a year x 2 ! ........... So how much is that worth ? ........... hummmmmmm well I will just say over half of the figure we all want to be worth and that is only one company. DJ stick with it , dont let the small things get under your skin, I think I speak for EVERYONE, we all want to see YOU do well ! Hang in there !

Guys ride around and look there is soooo much to be done out there. GO GET IT !
 
All the posturing the last couple of months has left a bad taste in my mouth.Some of the guys I used to think were uber professionals have shown a side I never thought I would see.
I could personally careless at this point in my life who I make mad because of who my friends are,what sites I help moderate or when I choose to have a RT and who is or is not sponsoring it.Drawing lines in the sand and challenging me to cross them will most assuredly get you that very result.
I have all but stopped answering my phone with the exception of Russ and a couple others because of the constant drama.

The price list is way off for todays market and IMO if Delco is going to persist in keeping it online they should make every effort to keep it updated yearly.


P.S.Thanks for the props DJ.It's a good feeling to help other and know they appreciate it.
 
Squirtgun said:
All the posturing the last couple of months has left a bad taste in my mouth.Some of the guys I used to think were uber professionals have shown a side I never thought I would see.
I could personally careless at this point in my life who I make mad because of who my friends are,what sites I help moderate or when I choose to have a RT and who is or is not sponsoring it.Drawing lines in the sand and challenging me to cross them will most assuredly get you that very result.
I have all but stopped answering my phone with the exception of Russ and a couple others because of the constant drama.

The price list is way off for todays market and IMO if Delco is going to persist in keeping it online they should make every effort to keep it updated yearly.


P.S.Thanks for the props DJ.It's a good feeling to help other and know they appreciate it.
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I couldnt agree more with your statment. People should be coming together and do there own things.

i'm glad that your taking a stand for what you believe in. I too will stand for what I believe in, people always dont see eye to eye.

Drawing lines is silly, everyone will always be welcome here and with anything else Im involved in. Get silly and unprofessional and I'm gone.

We will start advertising the events and new publication shortly after the first of the year.

I'm certainly glad you understand if the price guides around it should be updated.

You invited me to your roundtable and I would certainly still speak anytime you needed it.

As far as the phone goes i dont recall telephoning you in the last couple weeks so i hope I'm not on that list. If you call and ask me for advice as always i will answer you question like I have for the last 6 years every single time you have ever called me to ask them.

As far as being a mod here Scott, always welcome. But if you would like a break I understand.

To bad, it seems most of the BS is gone.

Hollar at me when your ready, maybe I will see at Russ's on a saturday. Told Russ i would come down your way for a good game.

Maybe we all should just go fishing?
 
Russ Spence said:
Jeff you are correct (I actually agree with a freakin democrat..... go figure ?) I see no way to make a million dollars by my self with a pressure washer ! (not in a year anyway) I too like to think BIG like Jeff, THAT IS HOW WE MAKE MONEY !

Funny I had people laugh at my prices from time to time, funny but I am always on the go go go, productivity breeds productivity. 4 trailers in the yard look good BUT they are not making money in the yard are they ?

Lets see I tried to use Delco when I first found the price list in 1998 ! Hell I almost worked myself to death for a few months, I then tried to go back to residential thinking that is where the money is.......... WRONG ! I SEE NOW, Several guys 3 or more years ago started opening my eyes to commercial flatwork, I tried to price a few local jobs at those rates and wow I thought ... NO WAY I CAN MAKE MONEY! Then I started to open my eyes after I saw it start to build a little , pretty soon I realized I had checks coming when some guys were whining looking for a house or worse a driveway to wash. Now we are scheduling for PM's in 2010, in fact we just got thru scheduling 72 shopping centers for 2009 and 2010 ..... 4 times a year ! That is 288 jobs a year x 2 ! ........... So how much is that worth ? ........... hummmmmmm well I will just say over half of the figure we all want to be worth and that is only one company. DJ stick with it , dont let the small things get under your skin, I think I speak for EVERYONE, we all want to see YOU do well ! Hang in there !

Guys ride around and look there is soooo much to be done out there. GO GET IT !
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I can't believe I agree with a republican LOL

I want Russ $$$$........oops I forgot I dont like working nights, hell I dont even like getting wet anymore LOL
 
Ron Musgraves said:
I can, are people not e-mail and helping? I thought this thread was getting that done.

I will look at the flatwork and post the a list of what I think it should be.

I do have to admit that possibly a disclaimer should be used on the new list.
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Ron: I have only received to two pricing surveys. People seem better willing to post their prices on this BBS rather then email to me. Do not understand why.

People will complain about the survey but will not contribute to fix it. I will do the best I can.

Please send me your recommendation to robert@dcs1.com. Keith Kunkel received delco@dcs1.com and forwards those to me.

Thanks for the support.
 
Scott Stone said:
Since their pricing has been the same for 15 years now, it is no surprise.

Delco's pricing is high on parts, but chems and machines they are pretty competitive. I was talking with Robert yesterday, and he is working on something so that he can become more competitive. That would be welcome, and I for one would start using them for parts, as long as the pricing was somewhat competitive.
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Although the pricing survey has not changed for while, continuous surveys revealed that pricing has been fairly stable within the range of the survey. Just in this last economic down turn has the survey fell significantly out of date on a national scale and needs updating. Remember it is a survey of what is actually being charged by some one in the market. It is not a recommended pricing for a particular contractor. That is your job for your company. Most contractors us the survey as a starting point for their companies and for work they are not familiar with.:confused:
 
Hot Shot Power Clean said:
Was that first sentence a question or a statement? I'm confused.
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A statement of how the survey is arrived at. It is changed based a National Average. Does that answer you question.:confused:
 
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