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  1. #1
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    National Property Management Companies

    We are picking up more and more retail sidewalk cleaning and the more we search the more we are running into the large management companies. Who are some of these companies that we need to get in touch with to offer our services? I have no problem working for these guys, with our equipment we can knock out the jobs quick and still make decent money.

    PM me if you don't feel comfortable posting them here... Ron, pick up your phone man!!!
    Jeff Robison
    Clean Up Atlanta, Inc.
    www.cleanupatlanta.com
    Lawrenceville, GA

  • #2
    Administrator Professor with Tenure Steven Button's Avatar
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    are you talking about actual Property Management companies or National Service Management companies?


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  • #3
    Commercial Pressure Wash Expert and PWI Administrator 19000 PLUS POSTER Russ Spence's Avatar
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    we run into the same problem, I have tons and tons of equipment to their zero and somehow (selling) they manage to seelmthe hell out of a completely intangeable company, I mean they are nothing more than a internet ghost company at best.

    I have one we do work for that you can actually hear the kids playing and the wife cooking while on the phone. haha I guess their office is like mine!

  • #4
    Senior Moderator Associate Professor FCPWLLC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russ Spence View Post
    we run into the same problem, I have tons and tons of equipment to their zero and somehow (selling) they manage to seelmthe hell out of a completely intangeable company, I mean they are nothing more than a internet ghost company at best.

    I have one we do work for that you can actually hear the kids playing and the wife cooking while on the phone. haha I guess their office is like mine!
    They manage to close a deal because quite often they are closing on a PRICE. Nothing more. No SELLING at all. They then scour the planet searching for folks willing to do the work as a sub for a fraction of the price most of us are willing to work for. A revolving door of technicians going in and out of business. They know this to be the case and take full advantage of it. They practically hang up on me after talking to me for a few minutes and realize I am not a "fit" for thier model. They truly are looking for dreamers of high volume and promises of $$$ by doing that volume, then the volume never comes. Leaving them stranded with accounts to do but not making any profit. They quit and in walks another dreaming technician. Those service provider LOVE them.

    Jeff, seems you've gotten lucky so far. Most don't find a middleman with hand in the jar and selling on price is workable. Good luck.
    Michael Kreisle
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  • #5
    JohnB Professor with Tenure JohnB's Avatar
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    Same thing with some of those So called Nationwide Hood Cleaning Companies.. I have had call after call asking if I would like to clean this fast food chain and that fast food chain.. I have actuall heard the TV playing Law and Order in the background from one of these companies .. You are right though they do have a good sales scheme and usually a nice website.. When these people call me I just tell them I am busy and dont have time to help, but if they would give me a list of the accounts they need done I may send them a 10% finders fee.. This usually gets them to hang up quick..
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  • #6
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    Steve, I guess I am talking more about the National Service Management Companies.

    Russ, Yes these companies amaze me too sometimes. I guess it's the allure of a "one stop shop" I am finding out more and more it is like Ron says eliminating one more headache by having one company to call. I would like to talk with you some day. It seems like you have a nice business and a good mix of good paying jobs and volume work to keep the bills paid.

    Mike, I am finding out more and more that with employees it is easier to work for less per hour and still be very profitable at the end of the year.

    Good or bad my approach has been to quote high dollar quality work first, then if they don't want to pay that price cut the quality, time on the job, and most of the times we both end up happy.
    Jeff Robison
    Clean Up Atlanta, Inc.
    www.cleanupatlanta.com
    Lawrenceville, GA

  • #7
    Senior Moderator Associate Professor FCPWLLC's Avatar
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    Jeff, not trying to hijack thread... Do you still have your Fury Vac system? Can I give you a call about it? I recently bought one and have some questions.
    Michael Kreisle
    First Choice Power Washing LLC
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  • #8
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Robison View Post
    We are picking up more and more retail sidewalk cleaning and the more we search the more we are running into the large management companies. Who are some of these companies that we need to get in touch with to offer our services? I have no problem working for these guys, with our equipment we can knock out the jobs quick and still make decent money.

    PM me if you don't feel comfortable posting them here... Ron, pick up your phone man!!!
    Jeff, call me when you can . Left a message.

    If you ever got wok brother just call the main line. I dont answer Cell alot...

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  • #9
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FCPWLLC View Post
    They manage to close a deal because quite often they are closing on a PRICE. Nothing more. No SELLING at all. They then scour the planet searching for folks willing to do the work as a sub for a fraction of the price most of us are willing to work for. A revolving door of technicians going in and out of business. They know this to be the case and take full advantage of it. They practically hang up on me after talking to me for a few minutes and realize I am not a "fit" for thier model. They truly are looking for dreamers of high volume and promises of $$$ by doing that volume, then the volume never comes. Leaving them stranded with accounts to do but not making any profit. They quit and in walks another dreaming technician. Those service provider LOVE them.

    Jeff, seems you've gotten lucky so far. Most don't find a middleman with hand in the jar and selling on price is workable. Good luck.
    What is an acceptable arrangement for a NSC?

    Let's assume the going rate locally for cleaning sidewalks on XYZ store chains is $100 every 15 days.

    Which of the following scenarios is acceptable?

    a) Contractor $80.00 - NSC $20.00
    b) Contractor $50.00 - NSC $50.00
    c) Contractor $30.00 - NSC $70.00
    c) Contractor $_______ - NSC $_______ name your price.

    Keep in mind the NSC has to advertise, pay salespeople, monitor the work from a distance, bill the customer, deal with non-payment/slow pay, and deal with problems.

    What do you guys think?
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  • #10
    Commercial Pressure Wash Expert and PWI Administrator 19000 PLUS POSTER Russ Spence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Shelton View Post
    What is an acceptable arrangement for a NSC?

    Let's assume the going rate locally for cleaning sidewalks on XYZ store chains is $100 every 15 days.

    Which of the following scenarios is acceptable?

    a) Contractor $80.00 - NSC $20.00
    b) Contractor $50.00 - NSC $50.00
    c) Contractor $30.00 - NSC $70.00
    c) Contractor $_______ - NSC $_______ name your price.

    Keep in mind the NSC has to advertise, pay salespeople, monitor the work from a distance, bill the customer, deal with non-payment/slow pay, and deal with problems.

    What do you guys think?

    If all I had to do was do the work and collect all the income from NCE?

    Thats a no brainer 50/50 ALL THE WAY

    I spend way way way way (I cant type that enough) more time selling, paying bills, collecting monies, getting insurance certificates faxed for auto, GL and WC. If I were to factor all that time spent doing those things I would be making half or less, we could work more and money flow would be way more positive!

  • #11
    Senior Moderator Associate Professor FCPWLLC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russ Spence View Post
    If all I had to do was do the work and collect all the income from NCE?

    Thats a no brainer 50/50 ALL THE WAY

    I spend way way way way (I cant type that enough) more time selling, paying bills, collecting monies, getting insurance certificates faxed for auto, GL and WC. If I were to factor all that time spent doing those things I would be making half or less, we could work more and money flow would be way more positive!
    You don't think you'd still have to run your business anyhow? Alot of those things are still needed within your company. You still have to schedule, hire/interview help, deal with WC, Deal with employee concerns including unemployment claims etc.

    Those companies really don't want Biz owners to sub to, but rather employee minded folks.

    Tony, I guess (c) My price and give then my normal marketing percentage. I say@ 15% (But only 15% of and accepted price, and not a price they already worked out prior to knowing your rates.) as that is an acceptable percentage that most companies are already spending on marketing etc.

    Tony the problem I see with them is that often they price based on a "going rate" that isn't in line with REAL Businesses. They come up with thier rates based on the cheapest they have found willing to do the work. ie the employee minded folks that don't want or know how to market but want the steady check. So them pricing on the low end and then still expecting a cut from it harsh. They seem to work backwards. They bid low to get the gigs, then scramble to find folks willing to work for thier given rates. instead of finding through a bid process, a base of contractors and then bidding the work with thier nut included. Most don't because it would truly require a selling ability and convincing the end property owners that it is a better way to go. Instead they simply focus on a low bid to get the gigs.

    Not ALL price that way, but a whole lot do.

    I don't even entrertain those service companies if they have already bid the job prior to getting the local input of the contractor on the ground. They bid blindly and end up losing those accounts eventually due to not being able to fulfill thier promises to property owners.
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  • #12
    Member 2000 PLUS POSTER Lou hoods&more's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnB View Post
    Same thing with some of those So called Nationwide Hood Cleaning Companies.. I have had call after call asking if I would like to clean this fast food chain and that fast food chain.. I have actuall heard the TV playing Law and Order in the background from one of these companies .. You are right though they do have a good sales scheme and usually a nice website.. When these people call me I just tell them I am busy and dont have time to help, but if they would give me a list of the accounts they need done I may send them a 10% finders fee.. This usually gets them to hang up quick..
    SLM & Dunnwell are ringing phone like crazy..

    Guess what my response is?
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  • #13
    Member Honorary Professor Dollarspa's Avatar
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    ...Ive always stated I've been a subcontractor from day one. so clearly I dont care if someone makes money off of me.

    quick story About 4 month ago national company ask me how much to do fast food .Told them 135 they said we only pay 85 I said okay Ill do it for that....... 2 weeks go buy (they are very happy daily report from their managers to them ) and than they added the word entire which isnt a bad word until you put it in front of the word drive thru so now they are paying 135.

    edit: I'm not arguing with mike or anyone and second part is before anyone says too cheap and wouldnt do it fine but but you dont know what the description of work is...and the final part is they get 200 plus and I get 135( per store) and I work every night 7 nights a week. and I am happy a very happy subcontractor
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  • #14
    Commercial Pressure Wash Expert and PWI Administrator 19000 PLUS POSTER Russ Spence's Avatar
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    everyones business model is different, now would I get out in the middle of the night for 200 bucks? No way! would I get out for 5 - 200 dollar accounts? yes, it takes work but if you take the good with the bad averages dont lie.

    Life will not work where I live on 300 an hour per man, but I can make it work on an average of 75 to 100 per man hour with great results.

    Like it or not we are in the top 1% of income earners in the South, thats not going to be the top 1% in Phoenix Arizona or Los Angeles but I am pretty happy and in all honesty we do it in about 6 months total. I do pretty much what I want when I want so I have nooooo complaints.

    I agree with Mike on the most part but we have and I assume always will disagree on the commercial vs residential part, hey thats cool because thats what makes for great discussion.

    I do not model My business after Mikes business and he does not model his after mine but I feel we are both pretty successful and thats pretty cool! 2 different ways achieving the same outcome, PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN!

  • #15
    Member Associate Professor Lou Zehnder's Avatar
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    Russ
    Wouldn't it be better in your case to hire a full time office/sales person to handle this kind of stuff. From what I here you are far from a one man show?


    Quote Originally Posted by Russ Spence View Post
    If all I had to do was do the work and collect all the income from NCE?

    Thats a no brainer 50/50 ALL THE WAY

    I spend way way way way (I cant type that enough) more time selling, paying bills, collecting monies, getting insurance certificates faxed for auto, GL and WC. If I were to factor all that time spent doing those things I would be making half or less, we could work more and money flow would be way more positive!

  • #16
    Commercial Pressure Wash Expert and PWI Administrator 19000 PLUS POSTER Russ Spence's Avatar
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    I was basically breaking it down to a one on one senario.

  • #17
    Member Junior Undergraduate Wesley Teston's Avatar
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    Russ, how many full time guys do you employ right now?

    You mentioned you make most of your money in a six month period, so do you cut back employees between your cleanings and then pick them back up each round you make? I think the last time I seen a post on this you had 14 or 15 guys.
    Last edited by Wesley Teston; 02-09-2010 at 03:33 PM. Reason: trying to explain reason for question
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  • #18
    Senior Moderator Associate Professor FCPWLLC's Avatar
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    I agree completely with Russ. Two different models. Don't think though that a middleman dictating the price and offering it up to ANYONE they can find willing to work is too cool.

    Ok if they are allowing the actual contractor dictate the pricing.

    Russ, you and I don't disagree on the differences. We just choose to do one over the other. I agree completely with how your model works. I just choose not to do what it takes to make it work for me. I don't really want to leave my area in order to get that kind of volume, which I would have to do. Maybe if my Boy was a little older. LOL
    Michael Kreisle
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    We own and operate a great Cleaning Service in Lexington KY as well as provide fantastic
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  • #19
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    When I started I sub from the largest pressure washing co ever.
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  • #20
    Commercial Pressure Wash Expert and PWI Administrator 19000 PLUS POSTER Russ Spence's Avatar
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    I started subbing in order to grow as well

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