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  1. #21
    Member Honorary Professor Mike V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by offdutyfireman View Post
    The orgs serve zero purpose other than to collect money and make someone feel important. Likewise, I have never had a client ask about orgs or other such nonsense. If you feel the need to spend money on an org, donate to a charity instead.
    Ditto....100% Ditto!!!!!!!
    Mike V
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  • #22
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike V View Post
    Ditto....100% Ditto!!!!!!!

    Mike, let me be devils advocate. What org has failed you, or what tool or equipment failed you that you have never tried?

    Some here say dont use a delavan? Why because they dont want you to know its a great tool.

    Until you have networked and actually used it I'm affraid you have no Basis for saying they are worthless.

    I'll bet William like some other things changes his mind when a lead from the org comes his way. Or someone helps him in a pinch, sure we can get that right here also.

    BBS is a form or org or knowledge, I'll bet that some here would say the same things about PWI.

    Its my passion this industry guys. Everyone should know this by now, so I might be one sided on whats its done for me. Its made it possible for me to tell the experinces and share the knowledge. I know William wants me dead, but he knows the only chance is heart failure. Send me some Krystals William.
    Ron Musgraves


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  • #23
    Member Graduate Student swrest's Avatar
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    Well.....all intresting.....very intresting.......

    What I am curious about is ..... do they "orgs" have any plans to further the industry via, law implementation. In just about every town around here, if your grass is too high, they warn you, and if you don't respond, they do it for you and charge you an inflated rate. Why naw laws or ordinances for dirty roofs, houses, drives and what not? This seems like it would be a great cause for the industry leaders to jump on. After all it makes since for all municipalities to adopt one standard, it can easily become a $$ stream for them, and overall improve the property values. Another issue that hits closer to my heart, is the strict adhesion to the clean water rules. Here in Florida we have a law called the Florida Litter Law, and it si as ambiguous a law as ever been written, but none the less, only selective enforcement seems to happen. Why the ORGS dont help draft a more intelligent piece of legistation that would more effectively take care of the problem of dumping, seems with all of there "experience" and "knowledge" that they should be actively on top of these things.


    This law is junk and they lawmakers know it, too vague and too thin, doesnt really address the problem of litter, just blankets everything into one peice of garbage itself. I have been on both sides of this law in the past few years, and not a single person can explain it correctly, except to say, it does a good job, oh yea does it really, whatever!

    403.413 Florida Litter Law
    (1) SHORT TITLE.--This section may be cited as the "Florida Litter Law."
    (2) DEFINITIONS.--As used in this section: (a) "Litter" means any garbage; rubbish; trash; refuse; can; bottle; box; container; paper; tobacco product; tire; appliance; mechanical equipment or part; building or construction material; tool; machinery; wood; motor vehicle or motor vehicle part; vessel; aircraft; farm machinery or equipment; sludge from a waste treatment facility, water supply treatment plant, or air pollution control facility; or substance in any form resulting from domestic, industrial, commercial, mining, agricultural, or governmental operations. (b) "Person" means any individual, firm, sole proprietorship, partnership, corporation, or unincorporated association. (c) "Law enforcement officer" means any officer of the Florida Highway Patrol, a county sheriff's department, a municipal law enforcement department, a law enforcement department of any other political subdivision, the department, or the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission. In addition, and solely for the purposes of this section, "law enforcement officer" means any employee of a county or municipal park or recreation department designated by the department head as a litter enforcement officer. (d) "Aircraft" means a motor vehicle or other vehicle that is used or designed to fly but does not include a parachute or any other device used primarily as safety equipment. (e) "Commercial purpose" means for the purpose of economic gain. (f) "Commercial vehicle" means a vehicle that is owned or used by a business, corporation, association, partnership, or sole proprietorship or any other entity conducting business for a commercial purpose. (g) "Dump" means to dump, throw, discard, place, deposit, or dispose of. (h) "Motor vehicle" means an automobile, motorcycle, truck, trailer, semitrailer, truck tractor, or semitrailer combination or any other vehicle that is powered by a motor. (i) "Vessel" means a boat, barge, or airboat or any other vehicle used for transportation on water.
    (3) RESPONSIBILITY OF LOCAL GOVERNING BODY OF A COUNTY OR MUNICIPALITY.--The local governing body of a county or a municipality shall determine the training and qualifications of any employee of the county or municipality or any employee of the county or municipal park or recreation department designated to enforce the provisions of this section if the designated employee is not a regular law enforcement officer.
    (4) DUMPING LITTER PROHIBITED.--Unless otherwise authorized by law or permit, it is unlawful for any person to dump litter in any manner or amount: (a) In or on any public highway, road, street, alley, or thoroughfare, including any portion of the right-of-way thereof, or any other public lands, except in containers or areas lawfully provided therefor. When any litter is thrown or discarded from a motor vehicle, the operator or owner of the motor vehicle, or both, shall be deemed in violation of this section; (b) In or on any freshwater lake, river, canal, or stream or tidal or coastal water of the state, including canals. When any litter is thrown or discarded from a boat, the operator or owner of the boat, or both, shall be deemed in violation of this section; or (c) In or on any private property, unless prior consent of the owner has been given and unless such litter will not cause a public nuisance or be in violation of any other state or local law, rule, or regulation.
    (5) DUMPING RAW HUMAN WASTE PROHIBITED.--Unless otherwise authorized by law or permit, it is unlawful for any person to dump raw human waste from any train, aircraft, motor vehicle, or vessel upon the public or private lands or waters of the state.
    (6) PENALTIES; ENFORCEMENT.-- (a) Any person who dumps litter in violation of subsection (4) in an amount not exceeding 15 pounds in weight or 27 cubic feet in volume and not for commercial purposes is guilty of a noncriminal infraction, punishable by a civil penalty of $50. In addition, the court may require the violator to pick up litter or perform other labor commensurate with the offense committed. (b) Any person who dumps litter in violation of subsection (4) in an amount exceeding 15 pounds in weight or 27 cubic feet in volume, but not exceeding 500 pounds in weight or 100 cubic feet in volume and not for commercial purposes is guilty of a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. In addition, the court shall require the violator to pick up litter or perform other community service commensurate with the offense committed. Further, if the violation involves the use of a motor vehicle, upon a finding of guilt, whether or not adjudication is withheld or whether imposition of sentence is withheld, deferred, or suspended, the court shall forward a record of the finding to the Department of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles, which shall record a penalty of three points on the violator's driver's license pursuant to the point system established by s. 322.27. (c) Any person who dumps litter in violation of subsection (4) in an amount exceeding 500 pounds in weight or 100 cubic feet in volume or in any quantity for commercial purposes, or dumps litter which is a hazardous waste as defined in s. 403.703, is guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. In addition, the court may order the violator to: 1. Remove or render harmless the litter that he or she dumped in violation of this section; 2. Repair or restore property damaged by, or pay damages for any damage arising out of, his or her dumping litter in violation of this section; or 3. Perform public service relating to the removal of litter dumped in violation of this section or to the restoration of an area polluted by litter dumped in violation of this section. (d) A court may enjoin a violation of this section. (e) A motor vehicle, vessel, aircraft, container, crane, winch, or machine used to dump litter that exceeds 500 pounds in weight or 100 cubic feet in volume is declared contraband and is subject to forfeiture in the same manner as provided in ss. 932.703 and 932.704. (f) If a person sustains damages arising out of a violation of this section that is punishable as a felony, a court, in a civil action for such damages, shall order the person to pay the injured party threefold the actual damages or $200, whichever amount is greater. In addition, the court shall order the person to pay the injured party's court costs and attorney's fees. A final judgment rendered in a criminal proceeding against a defendant under this section estops the defendant from asserting any issue in a subsequent civil action under this paragraph which he or she would be estopped from asserting if such judgment were rendered in the civil action unless the criminal judgment was based upon a plea of no contest or nolo contendere. (g) For the purposes of this section, if a person dumps litter or raw human waste from a commercial vehicle, that person is presumed to have dumped the litter or raw human waste for commercial purposes. (h) In the criminal trial of a person charged with violating this section, the state does not have the burden of proving that the person did not have the right or authority to dump the litter or raw human waste or that litter or raw human waste dumped on private property causes a public nuisance. The defendant has the burden of proving that he or she had authority to dump the litter or raw human waste and that the litter or raw human waste dumped does not cause a public nuisance. (i) It shall be the duty of all law enforcement officers to enforce the provisions of this section. (j) Any person who violates the provisions of subsection (5) is guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083; provided, however, that any person who dumps more than 500 pounds or more than 100 cubic feet of raw human waste, or who dumps any quantity of such waste for commercial purposes, is guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in paragraph (c).
    (7) ENFORCEMENT BY CERTAIN COUNTY OR MUNICIPAL EMPLOYEES.--Employees of counties or municipalities whose duty it is to ensure code compliance or to enforce codes and ordinances may be designated by the governing body of the county or the municipality to enforce the provisions of this section. Designation of such employees shall not provide the employees with the authority to bear arms or to make arrests.
    (8) ENFORCEMENT OF OTHER REGULATIONS.--This section does not limit the authority of any state or local agency to enforce other laws, rules, or ordinances relating to litter or solid waste management.
    Joe Crowder JOE@SWREST.COM
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  • #24
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Joe, Joe, Joe......I don't know where to start. I look forward to meeting you in Tampa.
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  • #25
    Member Professor with Tenure
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post
    Mike, let me be devils advocate. What org has failed you, or what tool or equipment failed you that you have never tried?

    Some here say dont use a delavan? Why because they dont want you to know its a great tool.

    Until you have networked and actually used it I'm affraid you have no Basis for saying they are worthless.

    I'll bet William like some other things changes his mind when a lead from the org comes his way. Or someone helps him in a pinch, sure we can get that right here also.

    BBS is a form or org or knowledge, I'll bet that some here would say the same things about PWI.

    Its my passion this industry guys. Everyone should know this by now, so I might be one sided on whats its done for me. Its made it possible for me to tell the experinces and share the knowledge. I know William wants me dead, but he knows the only chance is heart failure. Send me some Krystals William.
    You know I love you Ron. I wouldn't feed one of those Krystal burgers to my dogs though. I can send you some bbq and fried pork skins.

  • #26
    Member Honorary Professor Mike V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post
    Mike, let me be devils advocate. What org has failed you, or what tool or equipment failed you that you have never tried?

    Some here say dont use a delavan? Why because they dont want you to know its a great tool.

    Until you have networked and actually used it I'm affraid you have no Basis for saying they are worthless.

    I'll bet William like some other things changes his mind when a lead from the org comes his way. Or someone helps him in a pinch, sure we can get that right here also.

    BBS is a form or org or knowledge, I'll bet that some here would say the same things about PWI.

    Its my passion this industry guys. Everyone should know this by now, so I might be one sided on whats its done for me. Its made it possible for me to tell the experinces and share the knowledge. I know William wants me dead, but he knows the only chance is heart failure. Send me some Krystals William.
    I can see value in attending a round table, I am humble enough to know that there are still lots of thngs I can learn about the business. I initially thought it was silly and never would have entertained the thought of going to one, now I can say that if it convient and fits into my schedule, I would go.

    As far as orgs, I have never personally belonged to any industry org and while in my corporate life I had and have to take part in various orgs and trade shows, I see and have experienced ZERO value. I am sure for some people they are important and give them a sense of belonging, I don't need that.

    I have learned alot on these boards and from talking to various guys around the country, I will likely visit a RT in the future but I can't ever see myself joining an org. The one that is the most vocal in our idustry is laughable at best.

    Just my two pesos.
    Mike V
    "The Dean of Clean"
    All American Pressure Cleaning
    http://www.CleanSavannah.com
    http://www.MowSavannah.com
    912-308-8544
    Savannah, Georgia


  • #27
    Professors Graduate Student ABC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post

    Meet guys like me on the way out. Unlike most in this industry I'm done after 30 years. I hold secrets that can have you retired in 10 years. What's that worth???
    I have been asking you to have a RT in HOUSTON for many many many many years now.

    Now you say things like this. You hold secrets. What's it worth?
    What is this "Bomb" you are dropping?


    I might have only 10 yrs. left in my bones Ron.


    I invite you to have a RT in HOUSTON.


    Not all of us are able to make the RT "circuit".

    Not to mention Houston seems to have never had an NCE official RT.



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  • #28
    Professors Graduate Student ABC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike V View Post
    I can see value in attending a round table, I am humble enough to know that there are still lots of thngs I can learn about the business. I initially thought it was silly and never would have entertained the thought of going to one, now I can say that if it convient and fits into my schedule, I would go.

    As far as orgs, I have never personally belonged to any industry org and while in my corporate life I had and have to take part in various orgs and trade shows, I see and have experienced ZERO value. I am sure for some people they are important and give them a sense of belonging, I don't need that.

    I have learned alot on these boards and from talking to various guys around the country, I will likely visit a RT in the future but I can't ever see myself joining an org. The one that is the most vocal in our idustry is laughable at best.

    Just my two pesos.


    Well put, +1


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  • #29
    Member 2000 PLUS POSTER Lou hoods&more's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post
    I hold secrets that can have you retired in 10 years. What's that worth???
    I'm very curious of something, let's say you were dangling a carrot. How would you sentence change?

    See you either forget or wish to ignore the past we have......

    Many may see you has the Pied Piper of the pleasant pressure washing world. but your really not.

    I think your scrambling to change an image past, and the truth is we all...well I'll speak for myself I carry shame from deeds of my past. But I either learn and grow from the event or I do it again, till I do learn ..do get it right.

    And sometimes we over compensate

    I believe I'm clear with you now?

    As well has being slightly vague enough to the rest of the common peasantry to keep them confused. <---------joke guys
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  • #30
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lou hoods&more View Post
    I'm very curious of something, let's say you were dangling a carrot. How would you sentence change?

    See you either forget or wish to ignore the past we have......

    Many may see you has the Pied Piper of the pleasant pressure washing world. but your really not.

    I think your scrambling to change an image past, and the truth is we all...well I'll speak for myself I carry shame from deeds of my past. But I either learn and grow from the event or I do it again, till I do learn ..do get it right.

    And sometimes we over compensate

    I believe I'm clear with you now?

    As well has being slightly vague enough to the rest of the common peasantry to keep them confused. <---------joke guys
    I have given it to many guys here, most know it and some are doing it. I share openly, if you meet me in person I share more.

    I have guys at Roundtables that have doubled and some have made more than I have. They Listen to the secrets and have put many things I have told them into action.

    Tell me you have not improved from the guy working partime I knew 7 years ago. The things you figured on your own and the ones you took. Are you not on a faster path to retire?

    Maybe your not, maybe your just stuck making ends meat driving from one place to another. Maybe thats what makes you happy.

    I wanted a larger business . I'm done in 4 years, not because I'm overwhelmingly a success story. I have played the game and had fun, I set goals that I want to do some other things in my short life. I have other ideas and things that have nothing to do with this Industry.

    Meanwhile I have dedicated this BBS to the industry nearly ten years ago. Its grown to a powerhouse place for commercial contractors. Once a place for Grease guys now a place for all guys who do commercial cleaning.

    PWI is the commercial contractors paridise.
    Ron Musgraves


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  • #31
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ABC View Post
    I have been asking you to have a RT in HOUSTON for many many many many years now.

    Now you say things like this. You hold secrets. What's it worth?
    What is this "Bomb" you are dropping?


    I might have only 10 yrs. left in my bones Ron.


    I invite you to have a RT in HOUSTON.


    Not all of us are able to make the RT "circuit".

    Not to mention Houston seems to have never had an NCE official RT.

    The UAMCC might have one in Houston, I personally think its a great place for a meeting.

    I have no near future plans, Next year Florida, Phoenix and Orlando
    Ron Musgraves


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  • #32
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by offdutyfireman View Post
    You know I love you Ron. I wouldn't feed one of those Krystal burgers to my dogs though. I can send you some bbq and fried pork skins.
    I'll PM the address to the office...my wifes on a diet
    Ron Musgraves


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  • #33
    Commercial Pressure Wash Expert and PWI Administrator 19000 PLUS POSTER Russ Spence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thad View Post
    If y'all start that infamous green dot Ponzi scam again there's gonna be trouble.
    hey, I hooked you up and didnt get in trouble

  • #34
    WCR Sales & Founder PWRA 2500 PLUS POSTER Thad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russ Spence View Post
    hey, I hooked you up and didnt get in trouble
    I gave out as much as I could before it cut me off.

  • #35
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    NO Fair! I had more dots than Thad before. Did you run that by the committee? I've got my constitutional rights!
    Sonitx 845 S. Kenny Way Las Vegas, NV 89107 702-358-7477 Air Filter Service - Coil Cleaning - 2 month Payback


  • #36
    Member 2000 PLUS POSTER Lou hoods&more's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post
    I have given it to many guys here, most know it and some are doing it. I share openly, if you meet me in person I share more.

    I have guys at Roundtables that have doubled and some have made more than I have. They Listen to the secrets and have put many things I have told them into action.

    Tell me you have not improved from the guy working partime I knew 7 years ago. The things you figured on your own and the ones you took. Are you not on a faster path to retire?

    Maybe your not, maybe your just stuck making ends meat driving from one place to another. Maybe thats what makes you happy.

    I wanted a larger business . I'm done in 4 years, not because I'm overwhelmingly a success story. I have played the game and had fun, I set goals that I want to do some other things in my short life. I have other ideas and things that have nothing to do with this Industry.

    Meanwhile I have dedicated this BBS to the industry nearly ten years ago. Its grown to a powerhouse place for commercial contractors. Once a place for Grease guys now a place for all guys who do commercial cleaning.

    PWI is the commercial contractors paridise.
    Arizona

    Hoods & More
    Phoenix, AZ
    602-434-1169


  • #37
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Ellis View Post
    They add the illusion of experience

    I agree that is what Most Org's offer that for sure, thats why we made the certification status five years experience.
    Ron Musgraves


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