Profitable cleaning systems for flatwork, and more.

Sirocco Jerry

Active member
We are constantly asked "what's the best combination,
of pressure, volume, and tempeature," for cleaning concrete equipment.

Well, how about a simplified, and direct answer..
..an answer based on "affordability"..
..how fast one man will move (day-in, and day-out)..
..the "quality of clean achieveable," compared to equipment cost,
including our ability to keep it reliable, and Long-term-Low-cost.
Let's hammer-out a "sustainable relationship" here,
between you, the jobsite, and your "ability to afford equipment"..

3000 psi "barely" cleans concrete "kinda-fast".
4000 psi cleans "as good as most of your customers expect" fairly quickly,
..and with less water than 3000psi.
5000 psi is sometimes "really impressive" without even using heat.
(Hmmm.. chew on that !) ..Just be aware there's a big cost-jump going over 4000psi.

170 degrees cleans greasy stuff O.K.
..you can charge for your work, but you'll loose the job to someone with WorkSpeed.
200 degrees cleans REAL well, depending on the surface temp you are cleaning.
230 degrees will kick-butt in WorkSpeed.. gum goes flying at this temp, with 3500 psi or better.

4 gpm is all a beginner can be trusted with,
5 to 6 gpm can get clean to go fast, and with 4000psi will "put shoulders on you".
7 to 8 gpm will piss-off an employee at the end of the day, making him quit,
..unless you supply a good surface cleaner.. (21 to 28" dia. max).
A "tough guy" will get the 7gpm, clean like hell, doing it all himself,
..and take quiet, but frequent vactions.. because he is profitable, and his customers like his work.

So, let's add this up..
6gpm at 4000psi only costs 23 to 25 hp.
but 7gpm at 5000 psi is "unstoppable" with 31 to 35hp..
it costs 50% more, but "Studly-Dude" makes 25 to 50% more per hour in workspeed,
and pays off his loan 3 times faster.
Yes, he has to pay 50% more in maintenance costs,
but that's only about an extra $50. per month.

IF you ask youself..
"how cheep a 5 at 3500" I can get, or..
"what does the average user use" ?

..You are NOT a very "Studly Man"
and you will loose a contract to someone that is,
Or, you have employees you do not trust.

The best value, in my eyes,
..knowing "long-term-cost to own,"
..knowing which customers make more money..
is a 7 gpm 4000 psi multi-functinal system,
capable of 240 degrees at 5 gpm,
in the hands of a properly trained user,
with preventative maintenace skills.

..And a dual wand system..
12 to 14gpm at 4000, or 10 gpm to 5000psi with dual heaters.
Once you "get over' the price of a diesel engine system..
you will enjoy MUCH longer-term-lower-cost,
AND ALWAYS do a "compelling demo"

Whatever you buy,
demand that it have serviceability,
and safety controls that actually protect the lifespan of the system.
If you don't know what that means, get educated.
 
Good stuff Jerry.
 
Jerry,
will you please explain why you limit your machines to 240 degrees? Also, what is the pricing on this type of system?
 
I have a 11gpm 3200 psi and a 8 gpm 3200 psi both hot water heated to around 200 degrees and I still use my old 22 inch sweepers with 5 lb weights on them, and I gotta tell ya this still kicks ass !!
 
I've got to go all diesel. I mentioned a maintenance class for round tables! I think going diesel should be the one. It would be nice to have my tuck, heater, and machine all on the same fuel!
Thanks Jerry! I don't do much concrete, but this was still very helpful!
 
Between volume or pressure, my experience in my setups has been volume over pressure. I see concrete worn from surface cleaning at 3500 or less so I'm wondering about the higher pressures. Are you recommending those pressures for wand spraying normal flatwork? Time is worth everything so more more more power.
 
Great points, but I think you should expand this beyond surface work. Every portion of this industry is different in terms of needs and desires for pressure washers.
I just built my own waher and decided from the start that with so little surface work gpm was more important then psi. Another big factor was dependability and the ability to fix or replace on the go. Everything for me is modular and can be pulled out or replaced if needed. I don't have the luxury of being down for a week waiting for repairs or parts.

Diesel engines are the way to go hands down I agree, but like you mentioned the cost makes things scary for many. I have never used a gas engine to power one of my pressure washers yet and plan to keep it that way. One fuel means leas headaches and mixups especially if you have employees.

This is really a topic that could span multiple posts, my best advice is when looking for a pressure washer don't look at what can I get away with, more like what is going to make me the most and best use of my time. You get the right equipment and setup for your area of work and you will make $$ and be able to stay competitive.

Just a few thoughts to ponder
 
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Dont forget commercial Standards are way higher PSI rating than residential is. Parking structures and Gas stations should be higher than 6000 psi rating when poured. Some of those structures are rated much high. 5000 PSI wont even dent them. Wear and tear is not the issue, Oil and dirt can cause more damage of the surface than proffessional cleaning. We have studied this over long term.
 
reliability keeps you reliable.

I guess we are wanting Jerry to confirm that 300 plus won't clean better?

Ron, you don't miss a thing, do you !?
If you drive a train into a fortress, you will seriously affect the surface.
If you break-up the train into loose cars, and heave it at the same velocity,
you will have LESS affect.
I'm DONE with trying to throw steam at 4000 psi..
It is unbelievable that ANYone would try to argue that backwards.NUF SAID.

the subject of my thread should actually be..
"Sustainable profitability at the wand"..
As a manufacturer, I want a ROCK-solid warranty..
I don't want to run a Schedule 80 1/2" coil at over 240 degrees at 4000 psi.
Heck, I don't want to run it over 180 degr. at 6000 psi.
You will NOT need more than that.
..the heavier-hit in pressure gives you bonus-heat from the friction, anyway.
I REQUIRE that my equipment be "bullit-proof as posssible"

for as long as possible.
(That statement reminds me I can't make anyone read our operating instrictions. Eh?)
Anyway..
A whole lot of you guys have to admit (someday,) that being "over-analytical" wastes a HUGE amount of your time.
I'm trying to arrange it here infront of you..
a "sustainable system" for flatwork and buildings

Benjamin points out diesel engines rule for reliability,
and the varied applications..
My point in this thread, is about how much beef you can afford,
as the beef directly converts to WorkSpeed,
and "minimized downtime" converts to general productivity.
aka..
Having "plenty" of performance, makes you competitive,
having "plenty" or reliability keeps you reliable.
..You all are wanting to count pennies..
Just be sure you count 'em correctly. Eh?
 
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Great points, but I think you should expand this beyond surface work. Every portion of this industry is different in terms of needs and desires for pressure washers.
...
This is really a topic that could span multiple posts, my best advice is when looking for a pressure washer don't look at what can I get away with, more like what is going to make me the most and best use of my time. You get the right equipment and setup for your area of work and you will make $$ and be able to stay competitive.

Just a few thoughts to ponder

right on Ben,
This thread will likely spawn another..
I'm preparing notes for two more "system-applications" now.
..remember I have a "day-job" :)
 
Great thread Jerry, Thanks.
 
Kory, how many cfm's and inches lift is your vacuum system?

Thanks.
 
This is some helpful info. I'm looking to get my first hot machine and was leaning toward a 5.5gpm, 3500psi, 250degree unit. Maybe bigger would be better. I want a very multifunctional unit, one that I can turn off the heat and tone down the pressure (for wood etc)

Question: Can you have too much flow (gpm) for certain applications? If I got a 7gpm+ machine, is there any way to turn down gpms when necessary?
 
If you reduce pressure, you are reducing flow, as long as you are using the same nozzle. Make sure you have a bypass hose to your water tank, if you do this.

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