The Truths about the EPA every Pressure Washer should Know Please read

It could run into the street after running through the parking lot. If it ran into the street it would go down a hill and soak in along the side of the rd. I imagine diverting it to a grassy area on the same property to soak in is ok. Compared to it soaking in on the side of the rd? Either way it would never reach waters of the US. I can see where it running out of the property down a hill and across someone elses driveway would be annoying but what if it just pods a bit in the street and soaks in on the side? I can see this happening doing residental driveways. Do I really need to capture at the end of the driveway and pump back up in the yard? Is this bad for the yard?

What do you do with water that you cant let go into a roadside drain on a commercial job and you do not have a grassy place to pump out on the property. Even at 6GPM it adds up fast and even a large vaccum fills up quick.

I am trying to keep my head up. Obviously I am still new but I do not want to be a hack or here today gone tomorrow because I did not learn how to do it right. I look forward to some easy to understand advice on what to do in various situations.
 
Great talking with you, someone else may call you. If his name is Robert Jim or Jim they have no clue to actually how not to pollute without vacuums an filters.

Call Jerry at sirocco, Sunbrite is close to you an carry sirocco systems.


Ron Musgraves text me for
questions 480-522-5227 Pressure Washing Institute.com
 
Great talking with you, someone else may call you. If his name is Robert Jim or Jim they have no clue to actually how not to pollute without vacuums an filters.

Call Jerry at sirocco, Sunbrite is close to you an carry sirocco systems.


Ron Musgraves text me for
questions 480-522-5227 Pressure Washing Institute.com

But they are the grand poupahs of the ultimate knighthood of the immaculate perception of our industry Ron. Not to mention "icons" and "experts". Isn't there a law somewhere that says their utterances are to be accepted as truth just because of the source?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
 
It could run into the street after running through the parking lot. If it ran into the street it would go down a hill and soak in along the side of the rd. I imagine diverting it to a grassy area on the same property to soak in is ok. Compared to it soaking in on the side of the rd? Either way it would never reach waters of the US. I can see where it running out of the property down a hill and across someone elses driveway would be annoying but what if it just pods a bit in the street and soaks in on the side? I can see this happening doing residental driveways. Do I really need to capture at the end of the driveway and pump back up in the yard? Is this bad for the yard?

What do you do with water that you cant let go into a roadside drain on a commercial job and you do not have a grassy place to pump out on the property. Even at 6GPM it adds up fast and even a large vaccum fills up quick.

I am trying to keep my head up. Obviously I am still new but I do not want to be a hack or here today gone tomorrow because I did not learn how to do it right. I look forward to some easy to understand advice on what to do in various situations.

Hey Patrick.. Some of this stuff is blown out of wack and some of it is real. I can only tell you from my experiences in the 17 yrs now that I have been in this business. Besides checking out what the rules are in your own area and what fellow contractors may be getting fined for once again in your area I'll give you an idea what I deal with.

First off I learned from a few in this industry on what to do and what not to do. I'll leave those names out of it so this doesn't become a political type thread. I'll just give you the facts that I deal with here. I'm not saying what I do here is the law of the land or even the exact laws in my area.... its just what I do. On Residential we never have any issues with Environmental concerns except to say the products that we use today arent as good as they were years ago because of this green factor here and what I'm refering to is the VOC's when it comes to stains for wood restoration. The quality of the Stains has dropped here. They try to tell you here that the water based stains are better then the oil based stains and today that is sadly becoming the truth because they over regulated the oil base stains so we had some product issues but we never have had any Environmental issues ourselves. This is on the residential end. So I don't worry about EPA concerns when it comes to residential work. We do a neat and adaquate job without leaving a mess behind. So I'm good there.

The Commercial end is getting to be a bit more difficult. There are companies here that have recieved some pretty large fines because of water run off. One of them was in my favorite seaside town here 10 minutes from my house. This company was cleaning a Warehouse and the water runoff spilled out and ran into the water. There fine was in the tens of thousands... Probably caused there company to shut down.

On some of the Commercial jobs we do especially in the parking garage sector we are told that when we put in our bid or estimate that there should be no water runoff from the property that is to be cleaned. Also on a couple of Bids they requested a full reclaiming set-up. One of the fully reclaiming setup qualifications that this college asked for it was in there right to make that mandatory because its there property and this is what there requesting. I put in a bid for this job and if I get it this School is well known for something and I'll post where we were after we finish the job.... thats if we get it. Its been 6 months since we put that Bid in and Kathy(My wife) stays on top of this school to see how where doing.

I don't like that they want full reclaiming to be done so I priced it high.... so will see where it goes.

A couple of the other parking garages we do they also say no runoff from property. So we comply to there standards. We also comply to what they ask for which is to keep the garbage out of the drains so we Berm them and pump/vac the water that collects and release it thru my own setup ways of doing things.

So pretty much when I bid on a job I follow there guidelines on what they request to be done. I also pretty much Know what the laws are here when it comes to storm drains and its a common sense answer. No one wants to hear that your going to let dirty water pour down them. They don't want to hear that your not using any chemicals so your going to let the water pour down those drains...

Some of the other commercial work we do such as Strip Malls etc the requirements are less. Doesn't mean that its right... So the straight answer from me is find out what the laws are and use common sense. Commercial work if they are asking for something to be done a certain way because of Enviro concerns, Just be ready to do what they ask for if you win the bid.

Don't get overly worked up over this because you'll get yourself nuts doubting yourself. Just be smart and have at the very least ways to be compliant to what your customer is requesting and what the laws are when dealing with commercial work.

Besides that, Stay connected on the net thru places like these bulletin boards, Organizations and just networking with others in this industry to learn from them and to also let them learn from your experiences.

Good luck.
 
Patrick, if you can, read the Clean Water Act so you will be informed of what it really says as there are a lot of people out there using scare tactics to try to eliminate competition, sell you over-priced equipment that is not needed and misleading city officials to the point where it got the city of Houston, Texas into a huge mess with contractors getting fined illegally.

With the help of Ron M., the city is getting back to normal, contractors are working and not scared to wash anything. There was no help from any industry experts, no help from any of the orgs or any help from anyone to help fix this mess. In the background you had vendors trying to sell the city on bogus bmp's, telling them that we are polluters and other nonsense that made the bad situation worse.

None of this should have happened if we truly had an org out there trying to help the contractor, if we had vendors that cared about the contractor instead of just selling over-priced equipment that really was not needed to work in Houston if you know the Clean Water Act and read this forum a lot, especially in the past few years. Ron talks about stuff that most of the vendors, orgs and city officials out there did not know about and that is part of what helped the city of Houston start getting back on track.

There are people out there that have no clue of what is required in your city so you should start there with the Wastewater department (or whatever it is called there), the Stormwater department, etc.... and see what the drains are labeled and where they are. Then see what the property wants done so that you are on the same page.

If you need to reclaim/recover that is no problem but if they want you to haul it away then post here and talk to us about it, there are solutions to that also.

Good luck.
 
Thanks everyone and thank you Ron for taking the time to call. Today was a new day and I am still at it. By at it I mean pouring more money into a business with no clients. However I keep hoping and advertising and visiting etc. Today I purchased a Vacu-Boom system. I realize I may not need it much but the job I might use it on may lead to ten more. Not a small system but I think manageable. The manufacturer is close to my house and turns out they will be a good supplier for many of my equipment needs. They can even custom build for me when its time to go hot water. I also spent some time doing my homework on who to talk to and what to ask. Naturally everyone was at lunch or on vacation so I will resume that effort come Monday.

I appreciate the help, encouragement and various opinions and viewpoints. I hope to be so good in this business I can return it all some day. For now I will vacuum up all the knowledge I can and filter out the debris.

PL
 
Will bump this up
Pressure Wash / Power Wash Discharges Compliance and Enforcement Quick Finder
Section 301 of the Clean Water Act (CWA) prohibits a point source discharge of pollutants into waters of the United States without an NPDES permit. To legally discharge wash water, a pressure wash operator must obtain an NPDES permit for each discharge location. Due to the fact that many pressure washer operators are mobile, it is not realistic to pre-determine discharge locations and obtain permits for each location. Additionally, most NPDES permitted process water discharges require treatment and analysis of the discharge, which may not be practical for many pressure washers.


presw.jpg


The most common method of compliance with the CWA is to prevent process wastewater discharges to waters of the United States. If your discharge does not reach waters of the United States, then there are no requirements under the CWA. Examples of compliance without a discharge are vacuuming up the process wastewater or berming the process water and allowing it to evaporate. An additional method of compliance is to discharge the water to an NPDES permitted sanitary sewer system (the municipality may have additional pretreatment requirements before accepting your discharge). The most common form of non-compliance is to discharge the process water into a storm sewer system or into a city street that drains to a storm water inlet. Most storm drainage systems in Region 6 discharge directly to waters of the United States without treatment, which means anything that discharges into a storm drain is the same as putting it directly into the waterbody receiving the storm drain discharge.

Vehicle Washing

Washing vehicles is an example of a process water discharge of pollutants requiring an NPDES permit if it reaches waters of the United States. EPA recommends that companies or individuals take their vehicles to car washes*. If a car wash is not available, NPDES permit requirements may be avoided and impacts on waters of the United States minimized if vehicles are washed in a vegetated or grassy area where the wash water will be absorbed into the ground instead of allowing it to run into the street and then into a storm drain. There may be additional requirements if chemicals (detergents, waxes, etc.) are improperly used or if the absorbed water will reach an underground water body.

carwash.jpg


*A properly operated car wash discharges all of its wash water to a municipal sanitary sewer system that treats the wastewater before discharging from the wastewater treatment plant to waters of the U.S. Most municipalities have a pretreatment program requiring car washes to perform some type of pretreatment such as discharging through a sand filter and grease trap.
Source http://www.epa.gov/region6/6en/w/pw.htm
 
I read these threads, I e-mail the EPA (get no response) and I ask people who might know. Seems like no one does. I read the EPA region 6 power washing information that Ron posted. It almost seems simple. But when I fill out a online form with questions I don't receive a reply. So I seriously consider just selling everything and go find a job I hate but one that I don't need to worry about outrageous fines handed out for things I could not get information on or are so ridiculous and random there is no way to prepare or defend yourself.

What I want to do is pressure wash. Like Ron I love it, I think I am good at it but I am practically paralyzed from fear of doing anything with runoff. Where can I go to get real answers to questions about what I can and can not do or how best to do it?

I am cleaning a church sidewalk. My runoff goes into the street. Am I really in violation of something if my runoff does not go into a river, pond, lake, etc?

Can I intercept my runoff with a vacuum system and pump it back out onto the property grass area?

What If I am doing a bank drive through in the city. It is concrete all around. I can vacuum my water but then put it where? Saving it all and driving it off to a treatment plant is ridiculous.

I call the local cities and counties I may work in and there is no regulation. But will the EPA van pull up and fine me for cleaning because I moved pollutant from one place to another?

Pollution is bad. I get that. I used to work for a major environmental agency. However were not creating pollution were moving it and we are not clouding waterways. Where is the real and understandable information. I think this industry is killing itself as well as the suppliers to the industry. What's next to but the semi trailer I need carry around all the vacuums, separators, tanks, filters, berms, covers, oil socks etc that I need in order to make a sidewalk clean?

It is getting to the point where it is not worth it. Not only will I not be buying thousands of dollars of reclaim equipment but I won't be buying replacement nozzles either.

Tomorrow I was going to look at a Vacu-Boom system. Do I really need one? It might be nice to capture water from a driveway cleaning and put it up on the yard so it's not running down the street. But so what if it runs down the street, into the woods and soaks into the ground?

Yes, I wrote this while frustrated after doing more research, getting more confused and thinking that's it. Time to give up because the unknown goal is out of reach.

No one ever Answer you, are you here ?
 
EClean was Told Right here about the PWNA Model ord being Over. Out reach was changing this over two Years ago.

Mt Hinderliter Just claimed in a thread today he keeps in Touch. Is there any Public record to confirm he Told his members or BOD?

John the truth is what we have on our side, its wins every time. Have you checked the Ft. Worth Outreach for the EPA lately.

I was going to write an article for Allison about the Texas State problems will get repaired by this mans company. They have been hired to run out reach by the state of Texas, they have been through FT worth. I was invited back in January to attend city employee training. I declined http://secaenvironmental.com/about-us.html

John I can't be bought bribe or threaten to roll over to something I believe is bad for the future of our industry. The PWNA has failed us and so has the UAMCC over the 20 years.

I have been involved with Wash water control as much as anyone in this industry, I do not claim expert status. Only a Fool would claim that status, there's to much for any one man to handle that title.

Only people from outside our industry can assist our tradesmen to formulate the best practices.

Good Luck John , I have not given up or quit on the PWNA. They quit me remember?
 
EClean was Told Right here about the PWNA Model ord being Over. Out reach was changing this over two Years ago.

Mt Hinderliter Just claimed in a thread today he keeps in Touch. Is there any Public record to confirm he Told his members or BOD?

Yes, I'd like to know how Robert and the PWNA's bmp's in Fort Worth changed and were eliminated in their own backyard without their notifying the membership considering one of them is the environmental director and the other is on the PWNA board?

And why would they bring failed BMP's to other cities for consideration?

Is that what "having a handle on it" means?
 
Yes, I'd like to know how Robert and the PWNA's bmp's in Fort Worth changed and were eliminated in their own backyard without their notifying the membership considering one of them is the environmental director and the other is on the PWNA board?

And why would they bring failed BMP's to other cities for consideration?

Is that what "having a handle on it" means?

I do not think the BOD of the PWNA Has a Clue as to what Goes on, there own Enviro Team has no real Knowledge Beyond Talking about themselves and showing Pollution Videos of Sludge to regulators and other Contractors.

FEAR!!! Sell FEAR that one day they will be shut down, or they can become the Elite guys making Millions.

Tell your customers to wash often and control the Pollution existing on the property, reduce this by keeping the place clean.

The programs of these others are ones that are not rational Logical or responsible.

If Property owners allow pollution build up they are not being responsible. Its simple we as cleaners are the answer to keeping the environment safe for the future.
 
Thinking about all of this. Does anyone know where I can findthe regulations for OKC? I can't figure out if I have to report every sewer discharge point.I found them online once, now all I can find is hinderlitters documents everywhere.
 
Houston didn't read this, The local enforcement has no Jurisdiction over private Property Matters
Pressure Wash / Power Wash Discharges Compliance and Enforcement Quick Finder
Section 301 of the Clean Water Act (CWA) prohibits a point source discharge of pollutants into waters of the United States without an NPDES permit. To legally discharge wash water, a pressure wash operator must obtain an NPDES permit for each discharge location. Due to the fact that many pressure washer operators are mobile, it is not realistic to pre-determine discharge locations and obtain permits for each location. Additionally, most NPDES permitted process water discharges require treatment and analysis of the discharge, which may not be practical for many pressure washers.


presw.jpg


The most common method of compliance with the CWA is to prevent process wastewater discharges to waters of the United States. If your discharge does not reach waters of the United States, then there are no requirements under the CWA. Examples of compliance without a discharge are vacuuming up the process wastewater or berming the process water and allowing it to evaporate. An additional method of compliance is to discharge the water to an NPDES permitted sanitary sewer system (the municipality may have additional pretreatment requirements before accepting your discharge). The most common form of non-compliance is to discharge the process water into a storm sewer system or into a city street that drains to a storm water inlet. Most storm drainage systems in Region 6 discharge directly to waters of the United States without treatment, which means anything that discharges into a storm drain is the same as putting it directly into the waterbody receiving the storm drain discharge.

Vehicle Washing

Washing vehicles is an example of a process water discharge of pollutants requiring an NPDES permit if it reaches waters of the United States. EPA recommends that companies or individuals take their vehicles to car washes*. If a car wash is not available, NPDES permit requirements may be avoided and impacts on waters of the United States minimized if vehicles are washed in a vegetated or grassy area where the wash water will be absorbed into the ground instead of allowing it to run into the street and then into a storm drain. There may be additional requirements if chemicals (detergents, waxes, etc.) are improperly used or if the absorbed water will reach an underground water body.

carwash.jpg


*A properly operated car wash discharges all of its wash water to a municipal sanitary sewer system that treats the wastewater before discharging from the wastewater treatment plant to waters of the U.S. Most municipalities have a pretreatment program requiring car washes to perform some type of pretreatment such as discharging through a sand filter and grease trap.
Source http://www.epa.gov/region6/6en/w/pw.htm
 
Pressure Wash / Power Wash Discharges Compliance and Enforcement Quick Finder
Section 301 of the Clean Water Act (CWA) prohibits a point source discharge of pollutants into waters of the United States without an NPDES permit. To legally discharge wash water, a pressure wash operator must obtain an NPDES permit for each discharge location. Due to the fact that many pressure washer operators are mobile, it is not realistic to pre-determine discharge locations and obtain permits for each location. Additionally, most NPDES permitted process water discharges require treatment and analysis of the discharge, which may not be practical for many pressure washers.


presw.jpg


The most common method of compliance with the CWA is to prevent process wastewater discharges to waters of the United States. If your discharge does not reach waters of the United States, then there are no requirements under the CWA. Examples of compliance without a discharge are vacuuming up the process wastewater or berming the process water and allowing it to evaporate. An additional method of compliance is to discharge the water to an NPDES permitted sanitary sewer system (the municipality may have additional pretreatment requirements before accepting your discharge). The most common form of non-compliance is to discharge the process water into a storm sewer system or into a city street that drains to a storm water inlet. Most storm drainage systems in Region 6 discharge directly to waters of the United States without treatment, which means anything that discharges into a storm drain is the same as putting it directly into the waterbody receiving the storm drain discharge.

Vehicle Washing

Washing vehicles is an example of a process water discharge of pollutants requiring an NPDES permit if it reaches waters of the United States. EPA recommends that companies or individuals take their vehicles to car washes*. If a car wash is not available, NPDES permit requirements may be avoided and impacts on waters of the United States minimized if vehicles are washed in a vegetated or grassy area where the wash water will be absorbed into the ground instead of allowing it to run into the street and then into a storm drain. There may be additional requirements if chemicals (detergents, waxes, etc.) are improperly used or if the absorbed water will reach an underground water body.

carwash.jpg


*A properly operated car wash discharges all of its wash water to a municipal sanitary sewer system that treats the wastewater before discharging from the wastewater treatment plant to waters of the U.S. Most municipalities have a pretreatment program requiring car washes to perform some type of pretreatment such as discharging through a sand filter and grease trap.
Source http://www.epa.gov/region6/6en/w/pw.htm


Just a little refresher
 
Please Refresh this Info
Pressure Wash / Power Wash Discharges Compliance and Enforcement Quick Finder
Section 301 of the Clean Water Act (CWA) prohibits a point source discharge of pollutants into waters of the United States without an NPDES permit. To legally discharge wash water, a pressure wash operator must obtain an NPDES permit for each discharge location. Due to the fact that many pressure washer operators are mobile, it is not realistic to pre-determine discharge locations and obtain permits for each location. Additionally, most NPDES permitted process water discharges require treatment and analysis of the discharge, which may not be practical for many pressure washers.


presw.jpg


The most common method of compliance with the CWA is to prevent process wastewater discharges to waters of the United States. If your discharge does not reach waters of the United States, then there are no requirements under the CWA. Examples of compliance without a discharge are vacuuming up the process wastewater or berming the process water and allowing it to evaporate. An additional method of compliance is to discharge the water to an NPDES permitted sanitary sewer system (the municipality may have additional pretreatment requirements before accepting your discharge). The most common form of non-compliance is to discharge the process water into a storm sewer system or into a city street that drains to a storm water inlet. Most storm drainage systems in Region 6 discharge directly to waters of the United States without treatment, which means anything that discharges into a storm drain is the same as putting it directly into the waterbody receiving the storm drain discharge.

Vehicle Washing

Washing vehicles is an example of a process water discharge of pollutants requiring an NPDES permit if it reaches waters of the United States. EPA recommends that companies or individuals take their vehicles to car washes*. If a car wash is not available, NPDES permit requirements may be avoided and impacts on waters of the United States minimized if vehicles are washed in a vegetated or grassy area where the wash water will be absorbed into the ground instead of allowing it to run into the street and then into a storm drain. There may be additional requirements if chemicals (detergents, waxes, etc.) are improperly used or if the absorbed water will reach an underground water body.

carwash.jpg


*A properly operated car wash discharges all of its wash water to a municipal sanitary sewer system that treats the wastewater before discharging from the wastewater treatment plant to waters of the U.S. Most municipalities have a pretreatment program requiring car washes to perform some type of pretreatment such as discharging through a sand filter and grease trap.
Source http://www.epa.gov/region6/6en/w/pw.htm
 
We are not polluters. EPA regs are easy to follow when they aren't misrepresented or exaggerated in order to sell equipment or raise revenue.

Frequent cleanings are the answer to polution problems. Ron has been doing it for years.

We are not Polluters
 
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