Industry working together...True Colors...War with AHJs for Cannon Fodder?

Robert Hinderliter

Hall of Fame Member
There has been a lot of discussion of the industry working together. That has been happening, the problem is that 7 AHJs accepted our Garage Event Invitation, then suddenly cancelled.

Here is the support that was received in Houston by the PWNA for Ron's Event, that Ron never knew about.

From: Stephen Dicker [mailto:Stephen.Dicker@cityofhouston.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 12:48 PM
"Mr. Hinderliter,

I meant to ask you a final question. Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts for the power washing industry here in the Greater Houston area? By some portions of your emails, I'm not sure if your happy or displeased by those efforts and will discontinue them if so asked. Please advise...

Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer
Houston Police Department
Major Offenders division
7125 Ardmore, 4th Fl
Houston, Texas 77054"

Notice that PWNA could have stopped Ron's Event; but here was the PWNA Answer:


"From: Robert Hinderliter [mailto:robert.hinderliter@powerwash.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 5:18 PM
To: 'Stephen Dicker'
Cc: Almika Millage; Annise D. Parker; Cynthia Williams; D. A. Roger Haseman; David M. Feldman; Guyneth Williams; HPD Open Records Request; Nelson Espitia; Rainey DeMontra; Roberto Medina; Stephen R. Dicker; Sylvia Brumlow; email archive
Subject: RE: RE: RE: Open Records Request

Officer Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer:

You should absolutely continue with the Educational Seminars. These are extremely important to the Power Wash Industry, especially at the present time.

You responded Appropriately, with Dignity, and Professionalism by scheduling another Educational Seminar so soon after the last one because of Industry Requests from many sources. It would be a major mistake to stop them.

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars. That would be a big mistake for Houston, the Greater Houston Area, Texas, and the USA. If you do not know it you are having a National Impact.

You need to be commended for your efforts in putting together these Educational
Seminars!

Respectfully,


Mr. Robert M. Hinderliter
Environmental Chairman
Power Washers of North America
1410 Energy Park Drive, Suite 6
Saint Paul, MN 55108
Direct Phone Line: 800-211-0286, or 817-529-6601
Cell Phone: 817-366-3041, Office Fax: 817-625-2059"

Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events, and someone it trying to kill the Garage Cleaning Event in Las Vegas March 26, 27, & 28, 2013.

I will give you 3 guesses who that is, and the first two do not count!

Are we going to start declaring war with the AHJs being used as cannon fodder? What kind of Image is that for the industry? May the guilty party or parties stand up.
 
Okay, I confess, I admit it... I have no clue what AHJ stands for, but on the subject of "declaring war...." I submit the latest episode of "Culture in Decline".

 
Authority Having Jurisdiction
 
Can I ask what evidence you have of this? I know that often lower echelon governmental employees if they want to attend such an event, but that there ends up being no budget.
I am not sure if the cities were even posted that committed to come to the event, so I am not sure how someone, particularly someone that you feel is at odds with the garage cleaning event could have sufficient influence to uncover which cities had committed to the event. Incidentally, if there is someone that has sufficient influence to pull this off, I would think that he would be influential enough that he would be worth working with.
If anything happened, they might have done some research and seen some of the insane rants that were made you, John T. and others and decided they did notwant to lend credibility to such an event. I know when the cities I work with want to know about a particular person, they will take the time to research their reputation, and how they present themselves, and honestly, I do not feel the garage event has been well represented by the biggest promoters.

BTW, I thought this was a privately sponsored event, and not a PWNA sponsored event.
 
Another nutless post with innuendos and accusations.

With every passing day you convince me more and more that I have made the right decision in the direction I've chosen to pursue and the people I have chosen as associates.

After hearing yesterday, and validating today with a phone call from John T, I now know that you, Jim and he (John) have been telling people that I caused the EPA people to pull out of the garage event. John going so far as to refer to me as a f*ckbag (whatever that is) without so much as a shred of evidence to support such a conclusion.

The fact is I am elated that the AHJ's have refused to attend your sales event where you planned on selling your BMP's under the guise and false premise that this was going to be a simple "question and answer" period for contractors. Every one of these AHJ's have public meetings where everyone and anyone can ask as many questions as they like, right there locally. The state reps attend these meetings on occasion and are available for Q & A also. Jill, the Nevada UAMCC environmental director and I just went to one two weeks ago and asked plenty of questions during the public comment period that is available at every meeting.

Since I brought a witness with me to the meeting I won't even bother commenting on what transpired but will let Jill's report speak for itself. This is the text of the report Jill sent to the UAMCC for review by the Environmental team:

Las Vegas Nevada, UAMCC Nevada State Environmental Director Jillian Shelton
LAS VEGAS VALLEY NPDES STORMWATER DISCHARGE PERMIT
FEBRUARY 08, 2013
10:00A.M.
Report:
This meeting the agenda was gone over quickly and there was nothing in the agenda that directly affected
our industry.
A high up authority, who's name we didn't get, from the State of Nevada was in attendance and most of the
meeting consisted of asking questions of him.
They discussed the cost of cleaning SD inlets. Which brought to mind the idea to make some material
showing how precleaning by power washers reduces the the debris in the SD.
They discussed their TV marketing campaign and were trying to get something going to get people to stop
landscapers from blowing leaves and cigarette butts into the SD inlet.
The Gentleman from the state of Nevada spoke about a lot of things that had nothing to do with us. He did
mention something about an EPA requirement for Phase II to do something that the state could actually
"use their discretion" . We were unclear about what he was talking about.
Tony Shelton asked him to clarify. He thought we were just members of the general public so he went on a
few minutes explaining what an NPDES permit was and what Phase II was then he explained that while
some cities DO fall into the category that requires a permit under Phase II, the EPA is actually letting the
state use some discretion as to whether or not they want to permit those cities.
His response was
"What are we going to do, ask the cities if they wan't more regulation?....What are they going to say, sure!
Bring on more regulation?"
So he reported that the State of Nevada will not be requiring any more cities to get permits under Phase II.
The meeting ended.
Tony Shelton introduced Jill Shelton as the Nevada Environmental director of the UAMCC to XXXXXXXXX
and XXXXXXXX (don't know his last name). They already knew Tony. We thanked them for working so well with
private businesses here in Las Vegas and discussed any upcoming future regulations. They said they
haven't been audited in 8 years but they plan on making NO CHANGES unless required by audit in the
future. If that ever happens we will be notified long in advance and we will offer assistance.
Tony also reminded them that in the month of March a group would be coming down with a bunch of reclaim
equipment trying to push our industry off as polluters and possibly lobby for more regulation.
They assured
us that there would be no further regulation unless required by an audit. The discussion will not even be on
the table.
End.
Recommendations from this meeting:
We need to emphasize the value we bring by cleaning often and pre*cleaning debris to reduce loading of the
storm drain inlets.



We already enjoy a good working relationship with our local AHJ's. Chris already has built a reputation as a solid contractor that is regularly used for emergency grease and oil environmental cleanups and is respected and used by the cities here for their own sidewalks and even by the air force base. We practice what we preach and do our due diligence to make sure that we represent our industry locally by maintaining a good, close relationship with the local authorities and keep abreast of any changes that might be coming our way that could affect our ability to make a living.

THIS IS WHAT EVERY RESPONSIBLE CONTRACTOR SHOULD BE DOING. Even if only anonymously as a member of the general public just so they can keep up with things before they wake up one day and find that powerwashing is illegal because of a water shortage or because Robert's generalized BMP's have been adopted requiring pickup and transportation of runoff when no such transportation is even legal, as happened in Houston.

According to John, all the EPA reps from wherever Jim claimed they were coming from have cancelled. First I have no idea who they invited or what jurisdictions they represent so I would have no idea who to contact.

Second, I have had no contact with any EPA regulators from anywhere else in the country since well before Jim announced the dates for his event. But I have had, and will continue to have frequent contact with my local AHJ's.

What kind of Power Washer in his right mind would allow three or four guys who do nothing but post up pictures of filth and muck accompanied by the words "pollution" and "pressure washers" on every page, link, and powerpoint presentation to come in from other states like vultures without warning their local regulators about the potential for misrepresentation of our industry? Especially if all the local contractors have been BANNED FROM THE EVENT!

Thankfully, as they have stated before, our local AHJ's are bombarded with this type of sales pitch all the time. Over a year ago, in a conversation with the top guy here locally he told me that they (vendors) come all the time to meetings pushing their latest equipment and lobbying for the city to make rules that require their equipment. He said it is mostly in the construction industry. The regulators here recognize this as nothing more than a ploy to force people to buy what they can't sell otherwise and they have a policy to not participate in any of those shenanigans.

If there was even a shred of truth to Jim's and Robert's claim that this was only going to be a "question and answer session" and if they hadn't conspired to eliminate the presence of local Las Vegas contractors at their event to monitor the interaction I would have been less inclined to even mention the fact that they were having an event at all.

But I will be damned if I ever knowingly allow outsiders who have everything to gain and nothing to lose to come into the area where I make my living without at least warning the AHJs that someone may be coming who will falsely present us as polluters.

I will do the same thing at the next two meetings that come up before the event. Except now I will be armed with printouts of Robert's powerpoint presentations and a professionally bound book with many pictures and explanations that will debunk his false claims.

There was nothing I did or said to discourage anyone from attending any event. I simply warned them that someone may be coming who would try to push us off as polluters and let them know I would be available for any questions they might have regarding how we operate in case questions arise.

After talking with John this afternoon he went from blaming me to blaming Ron. What's so funny about that was that when this event was first talked about Ron called me and asked me my opinion on how we should handle this locally. (Since last year they did this in Ron's city and this year in mine) We both came to the conclusion that we should remain "hands off" because anything we do or say would just be construed as an attempt to sabotage the event. Ron never so much as asked me the names of my local AHJ's. I thought his conclusion was a little bit paranoid, but I agreed and neither of us have done anything to try to harm the event itself. I believe that contractors will learn something at this event about garage cleaning and have stated so publicly on the boards. The only thing that might reduce the possibility of that is Jim's love of trying to make himself feel important by refusing to share information, some of which is just common knowledge anyway.

The cancellation of the EPA guys is probably a blessing in disguise. Jim is apparently unaware of of how protective the casino industry is of their "revenue stream". Considering the fact that they all clean their own garages, if they detect that someone is going to come into their town and force them to start spending money on unnecessary equipment Jim and his friends may have found themselves on a one way tour of the desert. To be honest, with all the connections we have in the casino industry, I'm fairly certain a couple of phone calls could have been made that would have made it impossible for Jim to even get a hotel room for his event. But that is not how I operate. I have never operated like that.

If Jim is feeling lucky and wants to see if I'm blowing smoke, I would welcome his permission to make a few phone calls so he could see how fast his reservations could get lost or how fast his garage demo could be cancelled. I believe this could have been accomplished with less than three phone calls if that is what I wanted to do.

Yet, now, Ron and I are getting blamed for causing EPA reps to cancel from areas we have no way of even knowing about.

Consider the other option. Consider the possibility the Robert himself contacted them because he knows the last people he wants at this event are AHJ's that don't agree with his agenda. Or the possibility that some of them stumbled on Jim's know-it-all posts on the internet or Robert's thousands of pages declaring him an expert and they realized he wrote all of them. Or perhaps Jim was lying all along about even having EPA people there in an attempt to get more people to sign up.

There are lots of possibilities.

But the idea the Ron and I had anything to do it is not one of the possibilities.
 
The above statement and document is true. Tony never mentioned any names or companies for that matter only that a group will be coming down in march with a bunch of reclaim equipment trying to make our industry out to be polluters and possibly lobby for more regulation. We were literally there 3 minutes after the meeting and left.
 
Great Robert, working together and three years later you share.

Thanks

There has been a lot of discussion of the industry working together. That has been happening, the problem is that 7 AHJs accepted our Garage Event Invitation, then suddenly cancelled.

Here is the support that was received in Houston by the PWNA for Ron's Event, that Ron never knew about.

From: Stephen Dicker [mailto:Stephen.Dicker@cityofhouston.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 12:48 PM
"Mr. Hinderliter,

I meant to ask you a final question. Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts for the power washing industry here in the Greater Houston area? By some portions of your emails, I'm not sure if your happy or displeased by those efforts and will discontinue them if so asked. Please advise...

Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer
Houston Police Department
Major Offenders division
7125 Ardmore, 4th Fl
Houston, Texas 77054"

Notice that PWNA could have stopped Ron's Event; but here was the PWNA Answer:


"From: Robert Hinderliter [mailto:robert.hinderliter@powerwash.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 5:18 PM
To: 'Stephen Dicker'
Cc: Almika Millage; Annise D. Parker; Cynthia Williams; D. A. Roger Haseman; David M. Feldman; Guyneth Williams; HPD Open Records Request; Nelson Espitia; Rainey DeMontra; Roberto Medina; Stephen R. Dicker; Sylvia Brumlow; email archive
Subject: RE: RE: RE: Open Records Request

Officer Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer:

You should absolutely continue with the Educational Seminars. These are extremely important to the Power Wash Industry, especially at the present time.

You responded Appropriately, with Dignity, and Professionalism by scheduling another Educational Seminar so soon after the last one because of Industry Requests from many sources. It would be a major mistake to stop them.

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars. That would be a big mistake for Houston, the Greater Houston Area, Texas, and the USA. If you do not know it you are having a National Impact.

You need to be commended for your efforts in putting together these Educational
Seminars!

Respectfully,


Mr. Robert M. Hinderliter
Environmental Chairman
Power Washers of North America
1410 Energy Park Drive, Suite 6
Saint Paul, MN 55108
Direct Phone Line: 800-211-0286, or 817-529-6601
Cell Phone: 817-366-3041, Office Fax: 817-625-2059"

Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events, and someone it trying to kill the Garage Cleaning Event in Las Vegas March 26, 27, & 28, 2013.

I will give you 3 guesses who that is, and the first two do not count!

Are we going to start declaring war with the AHJs being used as cannon fodder? What kind of Image is that for the industry? May the guilty party or parties stand up.
 
There has been a lot of discussion of the industry working together. That has been happening, the problem is that 7 AHJs accepted our Garage Event Invitation, then suddenly cancelled.

Here is the support that was received in Houston by the PWNA for Ron's Event, that Ron never knew about.

From: Stephen Dicker [mailto:Stephen.Dicker@cityofhouston.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 12:48 PM
"Mr. Hinderliter,

I meant to ask you a final question. Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts for the power washing industry here in the Greater Houston area? By some portions of your emails, I'm not sure if your happy or displeased by those efforts and will discontinue them if so asked. Please advise...

Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer
Houston Police Department
Major Offenders division
7125 Ardmore, 4th Fl
Houston, Texas 77054"

Notice that PWNA could have stopped Ron's Event; but here was the PWNA Answer:


"From: Robert Hinderliter [mailto:robert.hinderliter@powerwash.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 5:18 PM
To: 'Stephen Dicker'
Cc: Almika Millage; Annise D. Parker; Cynthia Williams; D. A. Roger Haseman; David M. Feldman; Guyneth Williams; HPD Open Records Request; Nelson Espitia; Rainey DeMontra; Roberto Medina; Stephen R. Dicker; Sylvia Brumlow; email archive
Subject: RE: RE: RE: Open Records Request

Officer Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer:

You should absolutely continue with the Educational Seminars. These are extremely important to the Power Wash Industry, especially at the present time.

You responded Appropriately, with Dignity, and Professionalism by scheduling another Educational Seminar so soon after the last one because of Industry Requests from many sources. It would be a major mistake to stop them.

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars. That would be a big mistake for Houston, the Greater Houston Area, Texas, and the USA. If you do not know it you are having a National Impact.

You need to be commended for your efforts in putting together these Educational
Seminars!

Respectfully,


Mr. Robert M. Hinderliter
Environmental Chairman
Power Washers of North America
1410 Energy Park Drive, Suite 6
Saint Paul, MN 55108
Direct Phone Line: 800-211-0286, or 817-529-6601
Cell Phone: 817-366-3041, Office Fax: 817-625-2059"

Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events, and someone it trying to kill the Garage Cleaning Event in Las Vegas March 26, 27, & 28, 2013.

I will give you 3 guesses who that is, and the first two do not count!

Are we going to start declaring war with the AHJs being used as cannon fodder? What kind of Image is that for the industry? May the guilty party or parties stand up.

Robert, what "Ron's Event" could the PWNA have stopped?? I don't ever recall Ron holding an event in Houston??? As close as Ron and I have worked together on some things in Houston, I don't ever recall an event that Ron held.
 
There has been a lot of discussion of the industry working together. That has been happening, the problem is that 7 AHJs accepted our Garage Event Invitation, then suddenly cancelled.

Here is the support that was received in Houston by the PWNA for Ron's Event, that Ron never knew about.

From: Stephen Dicker [mailto:Stephen.Dicker@cityofhouston.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 12:48 PM
"Mr. Hinderliter,

I meant to ask you a final question. Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts for the power washing industry here in the Greater Houston area? By some portions of your emails, I'm not sure if your happy or displeased by those efforts and will discontinue them if so asked. Please advise...

Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer
Houston Police Department
Major Offenders division
7125 Ardmore, 4th Fl
Houston, Texas 77054"

Notice that PWNA could have stopped Ron's Event; but here was the PWNA Answer:


"From: Robert Hinderliter [mailto:robert.hinderliter@powerwash.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 5:18 PM
To: 'Stephen Dicker'
Cc: Almika Millage; Annise D. Parker; Cynthia Williams; D. A. Roger Haseman; David M. Feldman; Guyneth Williams; HPD Open Records Request; Nelson Espitia; Rainey DeMontra; Roberto Medina; Stephen R. Dicker; Sylvia Brumlow; email archive
Subject: RE: RE: RE: Open Records Request

Officer Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer:

You should absolutely continue with the Educational Seminars. These are extremely important to the Power Wash Industry, especially at the present time.

You responded Appropriately, with Dignity, and Professionalism by scheduling another Educational Seminar so soon after the last one because of Industry Requests from many sources. It would be a major mistake to stop them.

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars. That would be a big mistake for Houston, the Greater Houston Area, Texas, and the USA. If you do not know it you are having a National Impact.

You need to be commended for your efforts in putting together these Educational
Seminars!

Respectfully,


Mr. Robert M. Hinderliter
Environmental Chairman
Power Washers of North America
1410 Energy Park Drive, Suite 6
Saint Paul, MN 55108
Direct Phone Line: 800-211-0286, or 817-529-6601
Cell Phone: 817-366-3041, Office Fax: 817-625-2059"

Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events, and someone it trying to kill the Garage Cleaning Event in Las Vegas March 26, 27, & 28, 2013.

I will give you 3 guesses who that is, and the first two do not count!


Are we going to start declaring war with the AHJs being used as cannon fodder? What kind of Image is that for the industry? May the guilty party or parties stand up.

Please name the "events" that the PWNA has been supporting, that you speak of here? Are you asking the UAMCC or Ron Musgraves to support the Vegas Parking Garage Event like the PWNA is now doing?
 
There has been a lot of discussion of the industry working together. That has been happening, the problem is that 7 AHJs accepted our Garage Event Invitation, then suddenly cancelled.

Here is the support that was received in Houston by the PWNA for Ron's Event, that Ron never knew about.

From: Stephen Dicker [mailto:Stephen.Dicker@cityofhouston.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 12:48 PM
"Mr. Hinderliter,

I meant to ask you a final question. Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts for the power washing industry here in the Greater Houston area? By some portions of your emails, I'm not sure if your happy or displeased by those efforts and will discontinue them if so asked. Please advise...

Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer
Houston Police Department
Major Offenders division
7125 Ardmore, 4th Fl
Houston, Texas 77054"

Notice that PWNA could have stopped Ron's Event; but here was the PWNA Answer:


"From: Robert Hinderliter [mailto:robert.hinderliter@powerwash.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2011 5:18 PM
To: 'Stephen Dicker'
Cc: Almika Millage; Annise D. Parker; Cynthia Williams; D. A. Roger Haseman; David M. Feldman; Guyneth Williams; HPD Open Records Request; Nelson Espitia; Rainey DeMontra; Roberto Medina; Stephen R. Dicker; Sylvia Brumlow; email archive
Subject: RE: RE: RE: Open Records Request

Officer Stephen R. Dicker, Sr. Police Officer:

You should absolutely continue with the Educational Seminars. These are extremely important to the Power Wash Industry, especially at the present time.

You responded Appropriately, with Dignity, and Professionalism by scheduling another Educational Seminar so soon after the last one because of Industry Requests from many sources. It would be a major mistake to stop them.

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars. That would be a big mistake for Houston, the Greater Houston Area, Texas, and the USA. If you do not know it you are having a National Impact.

You need to be commended for your efforts in putting together these Educational
Seminars!

Respectfully,


Mr. Robert M. Hinderliter
Environmental Chairman
Power Washers of North America
1410 Energy Park Drive, Suite 6
Saint Paul, MN 55108
Direct Phone Line: 800-211-0286, or 817-529-6601
Cell Phone: 817-366-3041, Office Fax: 817-625-2059"

Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events, and someone it trying to kill the Garage Cleaning Event in Las Vegas March 26, 27, & 28, 2013.

I will give you 3 guesses who that is, and the first two do not count!

Are we going to start declaring war with the AHJs being used as cannon fodder? What kind of Image is that for the industry? May the guilty party or parties stand up.

I might be reading this wrong but all that e-mail tells me is one officer asked Robert if he should continue with his public education efforts. I dont see how that could have STOPPED the event.

Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars


Now if it said " do you want me to shut them down " then you can say you could have stopped the event.
 
I might be reading this wrong but all that e-mail tells me is one officer asked Robert if he should continue with his public education efforts. I dont see how that could have STOPPED the event.

Do you want HPD to continue or discontinue our public education efforts

I never intended to imply to for the HPD to stop the Educational Seminars


Now if it said " do you want me to shut them down " then you can say you could have stopped the event.

This is all just more ego maniacal ranting. If Robert ever wanted to help Ron all he had to do was pick up the phone and call him.

The mere fact that it took Robert two years to even reveal this correspondence to Ron says more than all the words in the post.

I hope everyone is finally starting to understand this.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 
That really makes sense.

How would anyone know who is coming to an event if names are not posted?

How can anyone tell people not to show if they don't have phone numbers of or know where they are from or who they are if their info is not posted?

The post over on the other site is posting 180 degrees different of what Tony posted here, it is really sad what they are doing just for attention.

Like I told my little brother when we were growing up, "If you want my attention, just ask".

I don't see how they can accuse anyone of telling the supposedly epa people and telling them not to attend if:
1. They don't know who they are, no names were mentioned in any thread anywhere.
2. They don't know where these mystery people are from as no mention of what cities or states were mentioned.
3. They don't have any contact info (email address, physical address, phone number) of the mystery people as none were mentioned in any of the threads.

How can anyone say that the epa people were told not to show up if nobody knows who they are? ? ?

How can you contact someone you don't know, don't have contact info for or where they are from?

This really does not make any sense to me at all.

Is there another way to find someone to tell them not to come if you don't have their contact info, name or know where they are from? ? ?

This really does not make any sense to me at all.
 
That really makes sense.

How would anyone know who is coming to an event if names are not posted?

How can anyone tell people not to show if they don't have phone numbers of or know where they are from or who they are if their info is not posted?

The post over on the other site is posting 180 degrees different of what Tony posted here, it is really sad what they are doing just for attention.

Like I told my little brother when we were growing up, "If you want my attention, just ask".

I don't see how they can accuse anyone of telling the supposedly epa people and telling them not to attend if:
1. They don't know who they are, no names were mentioned in any thread anywhere.
2. They don't know where these mystery people are from as no mention of what cities or states were mentioned.
3. They don't have any contact info (email address, physical address, phone number) of the mystery people as none were mentioned in any of the threads.

How can anyone say that the epa people were told not to show up if nobody knows who they are? ? ?

How can you contact someone you don't know, don't have contact info for or where they are from?

This really does not make any sense to me at all.

Is there another way to find someone to tell them not to come if you don't have their contact info, name or know where they are from? ? ?

This really does not make any sense to me at all.


The insane rantings are located here Chris: http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums...s-uamcc-committee-member-our-vegas-event.html

John, in the midst of us usual mischaracterization of our conversation goes on to say I had a "nervous giggle" when asked about who "sabotaged" their event. lol. Who among you have ever known me to have a "nervous giggle". This whole thing is hilarious.

All I did was warn my local AHJ's that someone might be coming to my city pushing for more regulation. As the UAMCC Environmental Co-Chair I would strongly recommend that whenever you get wind that something of this nature might be coming to your city that you do the same. If we had been doing this for the past 20 years we would have already accomplished the task of changing the perception of our industry from polluters to Environmental cleaners.

IF my warning my regulators is the reason they won't attend the event then apparently this method works and it should be copied everywhere.

I will leave it up to the UAMCC state reps, including Jill Shelton, who I am very proud of, to take care of their own states unless they request my help. I have not mentioned anything about Jim's event to any other EPA regulators and any such claim is just more falsehood dreamed up in the minds of lunatics.
 
Tony why would you want to be proactive with the local Ahj's you have to deal with on a daily basis that would make to much sense. Once they got wind of what was going on they most likely did the research and decided not to hitch their cart to that horse. They are probably glad to not walk into a compromising situation that could potentially jeopardize their positions. It could have been possibly misunderstood that they were endorsing certain equipment or manufacture's thats a no no for epa officials.
 
Here is the support that was received in Houston by the PWNA for Ron's Event, that Ron never knew about.


Notice that PWNA could have stopped Ron's Event; but here was the PWNA Answer:



Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events,

Robert, looks like you are not going to answer my questions and I am so glad you finally posted the email. This is the information that you were talking about when you Private Messaged me this info back when the Enviro thread was going on, and kept putting the words "Confidential" on every message. I am so glad you now have made it public so it is not Confidential.

I think you are misleading people, in fact trying to deceive them, by calling these City of Houston Environmental Seminar meetings Ron's event or events, and saying you and the PWNA thereby "supported" or have been "supporting" "Ron's Events" These meetings have been going on for years and continue to be held. Ron was simply an attendee, like you and I were, at two of them. They were hosted and put on by the City of Houston. NOT RON.

The fact that Sergeant Dickers emailed you ( if that is in fact the complete email communication exchange, as it looks to me like some emails may be missing and you simply copy and pasted and maybe edited off of two emails???) and asked you if you wanted them to continue is quite alarming, but then I wouldn't be surprised about anything that happens here in Houston.

If you remember, prior to one of these seminars, you called me and asked me, I think you called me from the hospital, if I remember correctly, that you wanted my help in gathering up as many Pressure Washing Contractors to attend the event as possible. You wanted to make some type of showing, or show of support. You really were't to familiar with the meetings and what they were. I explained to you that this was not the type of meeting to make a showing at as the people that hosted and put on the meetings were not the people we wanted to get mad at us in any way. (I mean they walk around with Guns and consider us Major Offenders) We want to get along with them and help educate them. I think at that point the nurse came in and you said you'd have to call me back but I never heard back from you. I also asked both you and Michael to please leave Houston alone, I think the words I used were, " we got this", meaning Ron and I. I as a contractor, that had been ticketed and fined, reached out to Ron for help, and he helped. (This was after I called the PWNA asking for help and was told I would need to join before I could receive there help, BTW) I am saying all this to say that I am pretty certain you DID understand that these City of Houston Environmental Seminars were not a "Ron Event".

To use this email exchange in the way you are trying to use it, to blame Ron or Tony, or anyone else as someone against working together, and to show yourself as someone that is trying to work together, is very deceitful. It simply does not represent the truth.

And just show you know, Tony has every right to discuss with his AHJ's, ANYTHING that he feels may jeopardize the relationship he has with AHJ's. Just like I do here in Houston, and every other contractor does in their City. Including you in Dallas/Ft Worth. I am 100% certain you would have done the same exact same thing that Tony did.

The quicker we can move our industry past this one lone gunman mentality that you bestowed upon yourself, and start educating contractors to deal with their own AHJ's ON THEIR OWN, WHEN NEEDED, the quicker we will be able to all enjoy doing what we love to do, with out having to look over our shoulder. Now, we can all either choose to be a part of the solution, or we choose to continue to be the problem. What's your choice???

Mine, is to be a part of the solution. Just so you know.
 
Doug Beautiful Statements and 100% percent correct and truthful.

Its clear that Robert wanted Contractors there, he wanted many customers to show up. Your right this was not the meeting for a rally, Robert didn't care about that. The more contractors the increasing chances to sell his wares.

Sergeant Dickers comments "will ticket every pressure washer we see and let the judge sort it out." Robert's now Famous quote to this statement to the pWNA bod. " There nothing wrong in Houston"

I'll repeat the statement again and again, I was on the BOD call. I hung the phone up, it was useless to continue talking to the leader when he thought this was acceptable.

These statements are the truth, the one statements on Video and many contractors witnessed it. Robert's statement was recorded in the minutes and Scott was also on the call.


Robert, looks like you are not going to answer my questions and I am so glad you finally posted the email. This is the information that you were talking about when you Private Messaged me this info back when the Enviro thread was going on, and kept putting the words "Confidential" on every message. I am so glad you now have made it public so it is not Confidential.

I think you are misleading people, in fact trying to deceive them, by calling these City of Houston Environmental Seminar meetings Ron's event or events, and saying you and the PWNA thereby "supported" or have been "supporting" "Ron's Events" These meetings have been going on for years and continue to be held. Ron was simply an attendee, like you and I were, at two of them. They were hosted and put on by the City of Houston. NOT RON.

The fact that Sergeant Dickers emailed you ( if that is in fact the complete email communication exchange, as it looks to me like some emails may be missing and you simply copy and pasted and maybe edited off of two emails???) and asked you if you wanted them to continue is quite alarming, but then I wouldn't be surprised about anything that happens here in Houston.

If you remember, prior to one of these seminars, you called me and asked me, I think you called me from the hospital, if I remember correctly, that you wanted my help in gathering up as many Pressure Washing Contractors to attend the event as possible. You wanted to make some type of showing, or show of support. You really weren't to familiar with the meetings and what they were. I explained to you that this was not the type of meeting to make a showing at as the people that hosted and put on the meetings were not the people we wanted to get mad at us in any way. (I mean they walk around with Guns and consider us Major Offenders) We want to get along with them and help educate them. I think at that point the nurse came in and you said you'd have to call me back but I never heard back from you. I also asked both you and Michael to please leave Houston alone, I think the words I used were, " we got this", meaning Ron and I. I as a contractor, that had been ticketed and fined, reached out to Ron for help, and he helped. (This was after I called the PWNA asking for help and was told I would need to join before I could receive there help, BTW) I am saying all this to say that I am pretty certain you DID understand that these City of Houston Environmental Seminars were not a "Ron Event".

To use this email exchange in the way you are trying to use it, to blame Ron or Tony, or anyone else as someone against working together, and to show yourself as someone that is trying to work together, is very deceitful. It simply does not represent the truth.

And just show you know, Tony has every right to discuss with his AHJ's, ANYTHING that he feels may jeopardize the relationship he has with AHJ's. Just like I do here in Houston, and every other contractor does in their City. Including you in Dallas/Ft Worth. I am 100% certain you would have done the same exact same thing that Tony did.

The quicker we can move our industry past this one lone gunman mentality that you bestowed upon yourself, and start educating contractors to deal with their own AHJ's ON THEIR OWN, WHEN NEEDED, the quicker we will be able to all enjoy doing what we love to do, with out having to look over our shoulder. Now, we can all either choose to be a part of the solution, or we choose to continue to be the problem. What's your choice???

Mine, is to be a part of the solution. Just so you know.
 
Tony why would you want to be proactive with the local Ahj's you have to deal with on a daily basis that would make to much sense. Once they got wind of what was going on they most likely did the research and decided not to hitch their cart to that horse. They are probably glad to not walk into a compromising situation that could potentially jeopardize their positions. It could have been possibly misunderstood that they were endorsing certain equipment or manufacture's thats a no no for epa officials.



My thoughts exactly Greg.
 
There has been a lot of discussion of the industry working together. That has been happening, the problem is that 7 AHJs accepted our Garage Event Invitation, then suddenly cancelled.


Notice that PWNA has been supporting your events, and someone it trying to kill the Garage Cleaning Event in Las Vegas March 26, 27, & 28, 2013.

I will give you 3 guesses who that is, and the first two do not count!

Are we going to start declaring war with the AHJs being used as cannon fodder? What kind of Image is that for the industry? May the guilty party or parties stand up.



How is the "cancellation" of EPA officials going to jeopardize your event unless the event was about the EPA and not the Contractors and Garage cleaning as you claim? Seems this was an EPA event, not a Contractor event.

No Sir it is you that have used the AHJ's as cannon fodder to portray Contractors as Criminals, polluters, or both.
 
Doug and Ron, were you both in positions in the UAMCC when things got better in Houston or not in the positions yet?

The reason I am asking is that maybe this should be promoted in the Cleaner Times so that contractors around the world can see that this org is there to help contractors and is already helping contractors and will be there for those that need help while other people and orgs that can help are not helping, in fact their people are making situations worse all the time by mis-informing officials and spreading non-truths and just trying to make things harder for contractors like they were doing in Houston until Ron and Doug got involved and made the situation better for all contractors there in Houston.

I think this would be a great idea since the other org has their ad in the magazine talking about helping contractors for over 20 years but did not raise a hand or do anything about the Houston situation, in fact their main person said and is quoted "There is nothing wrong in Houston" while contractors were getting fined illegally, harassed and had to spend time and money out of their own pocket to fight the illegal fines.

I think this speaks volumes of how help is available but not known until recently because of all the mis-information for many, many years to city officials and others out there and how there is an org to step up to the plate and give real help to contractors that they need and not sales speeches to the other side.
 
The hypocrisy and elitism never ceases to amaze me.

Robert will have you believe that bringing a witness with me to talk to my own AHJ AND making a public report about the conversation to the UAMCC Environmental committee is somehow wrong, while Robert having private calls and emails with AHJ's in an area outside his own is perfectly acceptable.

And that my actions to protect our personal interests locally are somehow trumped by his right to come to my city and have meetings with my AHJ's while barring my participation with security guards.

It is the height of Elitism. Even Obama has more shame.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 
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