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  1. #41
    Member 2500 PLUS POSTER Guy Blackmon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-PLUS View Post
    Doug, your welcome.

    Ron, I found an email where the minutes were uploaded to the MSN dashboard. I have know idea what my log in or how to access it. John or Guy might still have access. Good luck.
    My access was changed after I stepped down so I can't get it.

  • #42
    Moderator 11000 PLUS POSTER Christopher's Avatar
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    When this bmp was put up here on PWI a while back and many of us posted what was wrong with the PWN*'s bmp's, I posted a few pages myself along with others here, Mike H. called me and asked what the commotion was all about and assured me that the BOD of the PWN* told everyone that they would not be shopped, they were just looking for input at the time to make them better.

    They did not use the input (at least mine, Tony Shelton's and others that posted) and ended up shopping them anyway and even though we were told here and I was told on the phone by Mike H. that they would not be shopped, they were shopped.

    I am sure that people can read between the lines and see what is happening here. For those of you that are wondering why people don't like the PWN*'s bmp's, you nave not read them or have not kept up with all of this type of thing or are just new to the business or even possibly sitting in a dark corner with your eyes closed, hands over your ears and yelling "lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalala lalala" so nobody can tell you anything and you will not hear anything until you are ready. hahahahaha my little brother used to do that when we were about 8 years old or younger. hahahahahahahahaha

  • #43
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Rucker View Post
    Tony, was just wondering if anyone from the Pwna has contacted you regarding this.
    Doug, I sent a scan of the documents to the president. I have yet to see any action taken on it.

    Chris, you hit the nail on the head. I can see where this was going to end up. Some were going to try to say that it was Mike Hilborne who said it wasn't going to be shopped and he doesn't speak for them. That would be the only defense I could think of, even though Mike specifically said his remarks were ran by the board first.

    But as you pointed out Michael reaffirmed that to you also. He told me the same thing when I spoke with him a long time ago and asked him where the data came from that the BMPs were based on and he said they never performed any testing on anything but fleet wash runoff.

    Yet Michael's name is on these emails.

    Michael is very convincing on the phone and in person. Both he and Robert are good politicians with the good old boy talk.

    But a pig in lipstick is still a pig. You just feel much more stupid in the morning when you wake up next to it with lipstick on your face.

    The slow reaction time on this just affirms what I feared all along. Strategy on how to save face and keep the power structure of the PWNA is more important than doing the right thing and getting the pigs off the dance floor.

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  • #44
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    I am sure there are some who think my words are too harsh.

    When accepts a position where they are perceived as representing others or have some power over the future of others there has to be a higher standard.

    Lying about something that will affect the future livelihood of contractors is inexcusable and frankly, sickening.

    Anyone can make a mistake. We all do. If not for mistakes we would never reach our full potential.

    But intentional deception is not a mistake. It is a character flaw.

    Men and women who hold the future of others in their hands who cannot be trusted on their word have no business EVER being placed in such a trusted position.

    I think Mike Hilborn made a mistake. What he did to Ron was personal and just the wrong thing to do. Even today there are some feeble minded individuals who still think Ron doesn't have a real business because of Mike's lapse of judgement.

    But I don't believe Mike Hilborn was lying when he said the BMPS wouldn't be shopped. I think he was lied to.

    Maybe Mike Hilborne, who took the sword for two other board members who chose to lie about their knowledge of what Mike did should be put back on the board or back as ED to restore some integrity to the org. And the other dishonest board members need to be rooted out by any honest members of the board if there are any left.

    They should be easy to spot. They will be the ones who weren't horrified by the actions of Jim Gamble Robert Hinderliter, Michael Hinderliter, John Tornebene, Nigel Griffith and Jim Cooney.



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  • #45
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    The UAMCC should address this with member Officially by june 1st
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  • #46
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post
    The UAMCC should address this with member Officially by june 1st
    This should have been addressed immediately.

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  • #47
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Shelton View Post
    This should have been addressed immediately.

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    If you read the minutes it has been started.

    Nothing in these association Tony move fast. 18 people on both sides looking at the material. 410 pages isn't something anyone's going over quickly.

    Patients patients , the UAmCc business in this will be announced by this date and further actions will likely be taken.




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  • #48
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves View Post
    If you read the minutes it has been started.

    Nothing in these association Tony move fast. 18 people on both sides looking at the material. 410 pages isn't something anyone's going over quickly.

    Patients patients , the UAmCc business in this will be announced by this date and further actions will likely be taken.




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    They moved pretty fast to throw Hilborn under the bus.

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  • #49
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Apparently it takes a lot of time to figure out how to blame this on you and me.

    I have already been told this only happened because I posted Google Earth pictures of Steamaway.

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  • #50
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    I had my suspicions, but was unaware that Steamaway or Facilitec owns the PWNA.

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  • #51
    Exterior Restoration Specialist 21000 PLUS POSTER Ron Musgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Shelton View Post
    They moved pretty fast to throw Hilborn under the bus.

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    Again the leaders used as a tool, that was predetermined. This they just got caught with the hand in cookie jar.


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  • #52
    Member 7000 PLUS POSTER Doug Rucker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Shelton View Post
    Apparently it takes a lot of time to figure out how to blame this on you and me.

    I have already been told this only happened because I posted Google Earth pictures of Steamaway.

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    And how'd that work out for them? Lol
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  • #53
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    That is just spin, Doug.

    This really has little to nothing to do with me. I just happened to live in the next closest state to Jim.

    Last year they (the same crew) tried to destroy local relationships with regulators in Phoenix (according to them, but I don't believe they met with anybody) and this year it was my turn.

    I would guess Oregon is next. Jim wanted us to pay for his fuel to drive his rig to Las Vegas and unless Robert forks it over next time I'd imagine Jim's damage will be limited to states he can afford to travel to with all the debt incurred from fourteen inches of powdercoating on his rig and payments on his two compensation trucks.
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  • #54
    Member 7000 PLUS POSTER Doug Rucker's Avatar
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    Tony, What they have done to you reminds me of a team losing a basketball game, getting beat pretty badly, and in the final minutes start committing flagrant fouls because they are so frustrated and embarrassed because every weakness they have has been exposed.. What boggles my mind is that not one person from the PWNA has come on here to speak up and denounce the email exchange between Robert, Jim and your AHJ's, or the people CC'd. Hec, even Robert himself doesn't have the gumption to come on here, well excuse me, he comes on here, but doesn't have the gumption to speak about what he's done.
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  • #55
    Member 7000 PLUS POSTER Doug Rucker's Avatar
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    Hey Tony, just wondering if you ever heard from anyone on this....
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  • #56
    Moderator 11000 PLUS POSTER Christopher's Avatar
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    I wonder if anyone in the pwna knows what was done, is probably still happening and the end results in some of their work areas? I am sure most would not appreciate what was happening to them behind their backs and would quit that org fast!

  • #57
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    They know about it.

    I personally sent the entire 400+ pages of email correspondence to Eric Clark.

    Apparently the BOD had a meeting on it and told Robert to quit talking on the boards.

    So now, it goes from being somewhat openly destroying contractors to a completely hidden operation of destruction.

    Thanks PWNA.
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  • #58
    Member 7000 PLUS POSTER Doug Rucker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    I wonder if anyone in the pwna knows what was done, is probably still happening and the end results in some of their work areas? I am sure most would not appreciate what was happening to them behind their backs and would quit that org fast!
    Good Point Chris....
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  • #59
    Member 7000 PLUS POSTER Doug Rucker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Shelton View Post
    They know about it.

    I personally sent the entire 400+ pages of email correspondence to Eric Clark.

    Apparently the BOD had a meeting on it and told Robert to quit talking on the boards.

    So now, it goes from being somewhat openly destroying contractors to a completely hidden operation of destruction.

    Thanks PWNA.
    OK...did you hear anything back "personally" from Eric Clark???

    Do you, in your own personal opinion, think that the BOD of the PWNA, really told Robert to quit posting on the boards?? Wouldn't that cause his son, and IMO part owner of the PWNA, Michael, to ask his Dad to Shut up and no longer post on this board. I mean, I really don't see Robert doing that???

    "it goes from being somewhat openly destroying contractors to a completely hidden operation of destruction" what do you mean by this statement??
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  • #60
    BS Detector, Esquire 10,000 PLUS POSTER Tony Shelton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Rucker View Post
    OK...did you hear anything back "personally" from Eric Clark???

    Do you, in your own personal opinion, think that the BOD of the PWNA, really told Robert to quit posting on the boards?? Wouldn't that cause his son, and IMO part owner of the PWNA, Michael, to ask his Dad to Shut up and no longer post on this board. I mean, I really don't see Robert doing that???

    "it goes from being somewhat openly destroying contractors to a completely hidden operation of destruction" what do you mean by this statement??
    No correspondence back from Erik. I sent it a long time ago.

    What do you think Doug? Committee heads and BOD who secretly worked to damage Nevada contractors are still in place with full knowledge of the PWNA BOD.

    The mere fact that they did not remove these guys only shows that they approve of this kind of conduct.

    They have now been told to not engage with us.

    So any chance of open communication and input on what these scoundrels in the environmental committee might do in the future is now gone.

    True colors are shown. The move to destroy contractors' relationships with local regulators is now a covert, behind the scenes operation.





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