How about the outsourcing of the education program?

Clean County PW said:
Let me respond here and I'll try to make this short and to the point.

First off we the PWNA BOD as a group has decided that we should put these classes out for bids. Initially only PWNA members where going to be able to bid on these classes and its our right to offer this to our members exclusively. After a short while we as a group decided to also have non-members place bids if they so desire. Now with that being said we had a bidding deadline in place which was Feb. 3 06. Since we are now past that date we will STILL CONSIDER ANY BID THAT COMES IN BEFORE OUR FEB.20-21 BOD in person meeting. So anyone in this post who wants to bid you still have about a week to make that decision.

Now this part is also important and any and all who is reading this thread and may have an interest in placing a bid I want to make this clear..There is nowhere that we said a PWNA BOD cannot place a bid. This would be unfair to not give this individual(s) the same right as our members and non members are getting here. If a PWNA BOD(s) are to place in a bid then they have removed themself COMPLETELY from voting on who the winning bidder shall be. In essence they are out of this confirmation process 100%.

This we the PWNA BOD deem to be a fair process without costing us additional monies to get an outside agency to handle this. THis is how we voted on to handle this and some may not be happy about this but its that age old phrase that always comes to my mind when a decision is made which is "You just can't please all the people all the time". Remember all of this was a PWNA BOD Group decision which shall be carried out with the utmost integrity.


John Well said... but people aren't going to buy this for one minute. You can dress this up as pretty as you like, but the reality is people will take thier pressure washers and rinse it off, only to see what lies beneath.
 
Matt,
I was going to answer some of yours and others questions here but as you can see by the two post above me the bashing has now begun. You know me Matt so call me or email me any questions that you have and I'll do my best to try to answer them.

As for this thread since the bashing has started I'm removing myself from posting on it.
 
I'll step in as a Mod here and request that the remarks be removed and reiterate that bashing should not have a place. This thread has good solid value here and member/non-member opinions should be addressed. Very valid concerns have been presented and should be addressed directly, not left open for dissection.

Celeste
 
I would like to commend the PWNA BOD's for having addressed this issue in a professional manner. I am not a member nor do I foresee joining any time soon.

As a non partisan/invested bystander I can see how this situation can be viewed as a questionable process. It does have a tinge of kangaroo court proceedings too it. I would encourage everybody to try to keep the dialogue going.

The BOD has too expect some form of criticism in a hard to believe situation and should attempt to maintain communication and face the tough questions. We get enough avoidance and secrecy from politicians.
 
Clean County PW said:
Matt,
I was going to answer some of yours and others questions here but as you can see by the two post above me the bashing has now begun. You know me Matt so call me or email me any questions that you have and I'll do my best to try to answer them.

As for this thread since the bashing has started I'm removing myself from posting on it.

I really don't think any bashing has started...a bit of sarcasm, yes.

As someone once said, "You just can't please all the people all the time"
 
To me, I just don't see how a BOD member can say that they should be allowed to bid and be a BOD. When you accept a position on the BOD, you should know it will preclude you from certain things. You should know (again my opinion only) that if you want to partake in an opportunity, that the cost will be your seat on the BOD. Trying to do both seems to me like wanting to have your cake and eat it too. No matter how you slice it, you can't escape the dictionary definitions of the heart of these issues....you can't redefine a word or term to suit your needs...definitions are a part of our language and woven into the framework of our society... conflict of interest.


Beth
 
Maybe I am a glutton for punishment but I have some statements to make. Nobody is taking their ball and running. I came on here and have been as direct as possible and answer questions. If people want to look for something negative that isn't hard to do. Matter of fact it is much easier than finding something positive. Hasn't this become so prevelant in today's society? There are some very nice people on the BOD's that I consider ethical and professionals. Items of discussion have been conflicts of interest and perception. We would be wearing blinders if we did not. I like Matt's example of dick Cheney and Haliburton as I have thought of this as well. Cheney is not looking to become the next president but he has given up and sacrificed much to help lead our country as vice-president. He has taken many shots and criticisms, regardless whether they all have substance or not. This leads me to the following resolve. "Any organization that is representative of an industry should have a goal to educate and help the members of that industry." I believe that we should offer courses, not neceesarily certicications, in all areas of business and related to pressure washing. This should be the undeterred goal of the organization. I have said that for years and backed it up many times over personally that NO ONE should question. I continue to do the same but I will not back out of any process or action that I in fact have promoted and led. I will see this to an end where the PWNA offers educational tracts for any and all. If I or anyone else becomes a casualty then so be it. None of us indidvidually are bigger than the greater good for all. I have never wavered from this and have worked hard to get to this point. It would be better if we were all working from the same place to see this happen.
I keep saying this but here goes again, Call me if you want to talk to me about this or anything else. My ethics and what I stand for have not changed much since many have gotten to know me. I have always wanted what is best for the industry. If that means that a program that I endorse or believe in costs me or someone else their position then I am okay with that. Can all of you say the same thing? I do not need an answer to this. I really would rather talk to people who are interested in a give and take converstaion whether we agree or not. There is nothing wrong with disagreeing but remaining civil. Just a personal offering on me, I do not back down easily when I believe in something and have no problem meeting challenges head on. Why else would I continue to post? I do appreciate all all of you who are genuinely concerned and commented, thank you.
 
I hav a simple Questions,. Why was this info not published to Members prior?

It seems this would have made the whole thing look more on the staright and narrow.

Second What are the differences in the old way and the new?

Are we just asking someone to manage the program?

Didnt the last management company do that?

In the long run isnt this just going to leave the PWNA as stick figure for someone to run a school for education?

I wouldnt blame anyone here except the board members of the PWNA. I'm not blaming them yet, but if it shows nothing is different then my membership will not be renewed for any reason.

Now the thread started as a question that seems could not be aswered.

could perhaps the program is not clear and what they are doing not known. (even to themselves.) This is what it sounds like.

I know that all partys have class and are trustworthy.

I just think we are moving perhaps to quickly this time. in the past this org is like a turtle.

Please be positive and give suggestions and ideas.

Bashing people is not permited on this site. Personal Attacks will not be allowed.

Please use the bbs as a think tank, we can ask questions a people can choose to answer or not.

PWNA says they are on ground breaking advancement. Help them by suggestions.

As a members we can change things, we can voice opinions.

I want these thing changed in 2006, stop certifying NON-Members.

Allow the board members to talk open and freely about things, allow them to have there own opinions. Stop telling them we only have one solution.

Start paying people with all the money saved from not using a management company.

I know that sign up are higher now than last year, this must mean the organization is doing better.

We are saying money and membership is higher.

As chris detter would say, LETS ROLL BUDDIE.
 
Not my opionion, separate subject. No one on the current Board of directors should be involved in bidding.

If they want to bid they should resign and then offer a bid. I really dont see what so difficult about that. No company or legitamate anything would not take that approach.
 
From all appearances their is a breach of fiduciary responsibilty. Especially since it does not appear that there was an advertisement for bids. It seems a sweetheart deal was made.
But then, I don't have to worry about membership obligations.

Scott Stone
 
I am a member of the pwna, have been since '99. I have always wanted the org to succeed and grow. We (Beth and I) have donated time in many ways, we have been huge proponents of the pwna and promote it in all of our advertising, literature, signage, website, bbs etc...
The point I am going to make here is that as a member I expect to be heard and taken seriously. Dues are paid not only for benefits and the license to use the logo but to show a commitment to involvement and by being involved, it means to speak up, especially when I see something coming to light that could possibly have negative repercussions on my company and all the other forms of endorsement we have made on behalf of the pwna and its certifications. We have a stake in it by paying an annual dues and should not be brushed aside just because I am just a 'member' and not part of the bod.

Furthermore, no member should be taken lightly as so many have been involved in this thread and to my surprise that overall theme I have heard is that the decision has been made and thats it. IE; Tough doo doo, shut up and let it be because you don't have a say in it.

This position does not sit well with me nor does it with others as can be seen from the responses so far. My advice is from the position of concern and desire to help give feedback to avoid a huge potential black eye. The org may be bigger than any one person but it is not above any one member. Need I remind those who would refute this that an org cannot exist if there aren't any members who believe in what it stands for and lack any real faith in the leadership to serve it. I see this culminating in the stance being put forth as a precursor to a domino effect to disaster.

I am all for the education modules and the development of higher education programs/courses but I am not for seeing an org that I have made a commitment to; ignore, discount or push aside a members feedback in a play for martyrdom. Members are speaking out, the leadership is not being respectful in its current position and has not properly given the membership its dues. Too much is being done without membership consent or vote and this is the main flaw and in the same respect is creating a negative image towards membership desirability and has ineffect become a deterrent in my opinion.

This post is not to be considered in any way as bashing. It is constructive criticism and information that should be given every right of consideration along with the other members and anyone who is still considering membership in it a possibility. If any one person in the leadership role at this time takes this in as an attack or bash fest, you are no longer a functional part of the membership and should leave. You have lost sight of what you are there to do and are not thinking with the memberships best interests in mind which is what the membership elected you to do in the first place. You are not paid to take a personal stake in this and surely there should be nothing personal taken from a member who has made a commitment to pay you money to accomplish the goals which should reflect positively in all respects across the board.

What you do from here on out is under a microscope and as it should be. You want members and dues money to fund the orgs goals and initiatives? It should be understood from the very beginning that you are elected by the members to serve the members and not vice-versa. Do it responsibly.

Rod!~
 
WOW, Thats a pretty god statement. I think members have been forgotten.

Lets have this org be open, nothing should be closed for reasons othersmight steal.be teh leader and keep the others at your heels.

I want the org like many others to support all forms of growth in this industry and allow any notoneto gain from all this.
 
Rod.... Well said.

I have said this before and I will again...

As a member of the PWNA It is not only my right to question the leaders of the PWNA and thier decisions, It is my utmost responsibility to do so. THe beauty of America is that we can do the same with our government... When they stop listening and start executing thier personal agendas at thier constituents expense, we elect new leaders.

In the best interest of the PWNA, I think it would be wise for the BOD to rethink this process. Understanding that all of them don't read this BBS, Enough of them do and can take the concerns back to the Board room.
 
Rod,

Very well written and to the point. I don't get over to this board hardly at all but must commend the folks that are directing traffic on this thread.

This is a hot topic and most likely will get hotter. I am not a member of the PWNA so I do not have a say in the process (I think it's coming to light that members don't have a say so either but that is another topic)

Anyway,

I hope what ever decisions are made the are made with the best interest for the industry....
 
Newlook said:
Rod,

This is a hot topic and most likely will get hotter. I am not a member of the PWNA so I do not have a say in the process (I think it's coming to light that members don't have a say so either but that is another topic)

Carlos,
I don't know what you know but here's something that you may not have known. I went out of my way and talked to the PWNA President Paul Horsley to express my idea of having Russel come down to Memphis on an Invite from us so he can tell us about the Wrapi org. first hand. This way we can listen to what Russ has to say without any interuptions and just maybe something positive can come out of this. With all this new org. stuff going on I feel its in the best interest for all to meet face to face and maybe learn a thing or two about each other.

BUT what disturbs me and quite honestly has me peeved is that his co-founder being you would make an accusation like the one you made above. If I thought for a second a founder or a co-founder of another Org. was going to make what I feel is a false accusations about us I would have never ever had made this proposition to my President.

I am baffled that you would expressed that idea so publically like that and I will tell you that as a PWNA BOD I always listen to my fellow members as the other BOD's do and all of that is always considered when we make decisions. I think Beth can attest to this also since she is a past BOD. We have a democratic process and we are elected by our members but somewhere once where in as you will see with Wrapi, we have decisons to make and we always like to think that we are doing in the long run whats best for our members.

We do have integrity.
 
Instead of editing my above post because I do not have anything to hide I would like to comment about it so others can see that where all trying to do the right thing here and this goes for all sides. We are not each others enemies!!!

After I post this I was contacted By Russel Cissell who is the Founder of Wrapi. We had a chat and we both made our points. I think he respects where I'm coming from as I do of him. Once we both calmed down which was immediately because where both passionate about or orgs. we had a constructive conversation. He gave me a little more insight about the Wrapi org. so I can get a better understanding of it and in turn I spoke to him how we all want to better the industry and that is the number one purpose of what the Goals are of the PWNA BOD. I know the PWNA is catching some flack in this thread but I do assure all here that we are trying to do whats best for the Org.. and I think that Everett has stated that numerous times in the past.

There's alot of mis-communication thats going on here and its causing the tensions and frustrations to elevate to high.

Wrapi's representative next week which will be Russel is going to meet with us the PWNA BOD's to discuss there org. along with our org. and will see what happens. Either way I know my org. is trying to do whats best for the industry and Russel feels likewise about his org. So with that being said any member or potential members for each we hope can see this.

Carlos--My response to you above just shows the passion I feel towards the PWNA and I hope you can respect that. IT was not meant in any way shape or form to discredit you with your position within the Wrapi Org. Welcome to the big leagues..............
 
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