Money back on workers compensation

A

AaronSherrill

New member
Need a stimulus plan?

For all those out there who are paying workers compensation (which is most of you, if not all), ADP has now picked up some new carriers to our list of A-Rated Insurance companies that are willing to give up to 10% back in credits/dividends to responsible employers.

In addition to the money back, ADP also sets you up on pay-by-pay so that there is no more painful audit at the end of the year. You are paying as you go based on actual work completed, not estimated.

This is one of the many valuable services provided by ADP to our clients as well as payroll, tax filing, direct deposit and health insurance.

Feel free to contact me if you need any additonal information!

Aaron Sherill
ADP District Manager
Aaron_Sherrill@adp.com
407.435.5355
 
AaronSherrill said:
Need a stimulus plan?

For all those out there who are paying workers compensation (which is most of you, if not all), ADP has now picked up some new carriers to our list of A-Rated Insurance companies that are willing to give up to 10% back in credits/dividends to responsible employers.

In addition to the money back, ADP also sets you up on pay-by-pay so that there is no more painful audit at the end of the year. You are paying as you go based on actual work completed, not estimated.

This is one of the many valuable services provided by ADP to our clients as well as payroll, tax filing, direct deposit and health insurance.

Feel free to contact me if you need any additonal information!

Aaron Sherill
ADP District Manager
Aaron_Sherrill@adp.com
407.435.5355
Click to expand...

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AaronSherrill said:
Need a stimulus plan?

For all those out there who are paying workers compensation (which is most of you, if not all), ADP has now picked up some new carriers to our list of A-Rated Insurance companies that are willing to give up to 10% back in credits/dividends to responsible employers.

In addition to the money back, ADP also sets you up on pay-by-pay so that there is no more painful audit at the end of the year. You are paying as you go based on actual work completed, not estimated.

This is one of the many valuable services provided by ADP to our clients as well as payroll, tax filing, direct deposit and health insurance.

Feel free to contact me if you need any additonal information!

Aaron Sherill
ADP District Manager
Aaron_Sherrill@adp.com
407.435.5355
Click to expand...

While you're here can you explain the correlation between payroll and workers's comp cost and/or general liability insurance? I'd like to understand why it is the business of the insurance company what my gross income is.

My insurance agent can't explain it to me.

Why does it make a difference in the cost of my workers' comp or general liability if I have:

a) Four 35 year old male employees who make $100,000 per year each and my gross is $5 million

or

b) Four 35 year old male employees who make $20,000 per year each and my gross is $100k.

I still have the same four employees. How is it anyone's business what I pay them or what I gross? I'm sure there's a reason, I just have never been given one.

I suspect it is simply to determine who the insurance companies can steal the most from.
 
I think that maybe you are right Tony.
 
Paul Kassander said:
I was told it is a matter of liability if you get sued.
Click to expand...

Paul, isn't that what insurance is for? What kind of country do we live in where justice is determined by how deep pockets are.

Here's an example

Company A
No Profits
On the Brink of Bankruptcy
Has $1,000,000 liabliity ins.
I lose an arm because of their product.
My arm is worth no more than 1 million, insurance pays it out.

Company B
Millions in profits
has $1,000,000 liability ins.
I lose an arm because of their product.
My arm is worth whatever the scumbag POS lawyer can get.

How does my arm change in value based on who damaged it?

How does the profitability of company B affect the insurance payout? It is still limited to $1 mil. But the profitable company has to pay more for the policy.

I'm still awaiting an explanation from anybody.

My personal opinion is that ALL and I mean ALL the problems facing this country today can be traced back to four professions.
1)Lawyers
2)Politicians
3)Insurance companies
4)Public and higher education

a) If we made the loser pay in every lawsuit 3/4 of the lawyers would disappear.
b) If we made public service limited to 12 years per person, PERIOD, then only people who actually give a crap about our country would be in politics.
c) if we did "a" above there would be little liability and health care would be something we could pay out of our pocket like it used to be.
d) if parents were given their tax money back to send their kids to the school of their choice, we could be spared the indoctrination that has our kids telling us to recycle because global warming is killing all the snipes in the world.

Ok, I got off on a tangent.
 
From what I was told, Gross revenue and payrolls are used to determine exposure to risk. They somehow calculate your premium based on the amount you are exposed to the possibility of damaging or employees being hurt.

I too think that even that explanation is secret code for.... you have more, so we want more.

Same with the fact that the SAME phone line being used by a stay at home, gossiping housewife somehow will cost a business more per month. A business line is triple what a home line costs. All because you stand to make $$$ from your phone versus the home line. They just want a piece of the pie. Same goes for the 3 lines of ink in the classifieds section of the newspaper. Gararage sale listing on the SAME page that has potential to make advertiser big $$$, is 1/4th the price of the BUSINESS's ad on the very same page that gets same amout of readership and exposure. But because you are a business, they want a cut of your profits.

Off the soap box...
 
FCPWLLC said:
From what I was told, Gross revenue and payrolls are used to determine exposure to risk. They somehow calculate your premium based on the amount you are exposed to the possibility of damaging or employees being hurt.

I too think that even that explanation is secret code for.... you have more, so we want more.

Same with the fact that the SAME phone line being used by a stay at home, gossiping housewife somehow will cost a business more per month. A business line is triple what a home line costs. All because you stand to make $$$ from your phone versus the home line. They just want a piece of the pie. Same goes for the 3 lines of ink in the classifieds section of the newspaper. Gararage sale listing on the SAME page that has potential to make advertiser big $$$, is 1/4th the price of the BUSINESS's ad on the very same page that gets same amout of readership and exposure. But because you are a business, they want a cut of your profits.

Off the soap box...
Click to expand...

Thanks Michael. That's a scumbag business model that ties the value to how much a person has available to pay. Value does not vary minute to minute depending on who the customer is. This is a flawed system based on fraud.

I love to see scumbag businesses like that suffer.

I've been told the same thing you've been told. Here, read it again. And again. It's just plain fraud and profiteering.
From what I was told, Gross revenue and payrolls are used to determine exposure to risk. They somehow calculate your premium based on the amount you are exposed to the possibility of damaging or employees being hurt.
 
I think it was Aaron who called me on the phone and I further explained my questions. He was going to get with someone else in the office and call me back later.

Still know answer. How can a 1 million liability policy cost me more depending on my payroll and not simply on the number of employees? How does what I pay my employees correlate with a higher risk when the risk tops out at 1 mil anyway?

No one can answer this question.
 
Payroll as well as the type of job is what workers comp is based on. The insurance companies employ people called actuaries that look at the history of the jobs, industry and determine risk. These aren't people like you and me that look at people individually they only look at numbers. Such as a residential roofing contractor. The average loss per million $ of revenue for medical expense. That includes those that are careful with never a loss and those idiots that don't care about employees and have big losses.

The more business you do the more "exposure" they have. At least in theory. They know what the average employee per industry at each geographic location makes. Gross receipts vs profits is of no interest in the equation. Workman's comp usually covers actual medical. Your general liability kicks in if gross negligence is shown for the big payouts.

Payroll determines: Workman's comp (the amount of employees exposed to possible injury)
Gross sales determines: General liability (the amount of business exposed to liability)

The biggest mistake I see is incompetent agents that incorrectly classify employees for higher risk categories.
 
IndyExterior said:
Payroll as well as the type of job is what workers comp is based on. The insurance companies employ people called actuaries that look at the history of the jobs, industry and determine risk. These aren't people like you and me that look at people individually they only look at numbers. Such as a residential roofing contractor. The average loss per million $ of revenue for medical expense. That includes those that are careful with never a loss and those idiots that don't care about employees and have big losses.

The more business you do the more "exposure" they have. At least in theory. They know what the average employee per industry at each geographic location makes. Gross receipts vs profits is of no interest in the equation. Workman's comp usually covers actual medical. Your general liability kicks in if gross negligence is shown for the big payouts.

Payroll determines: Workman's comp (the amount of employees exposed to possible injury)
Gross sales determines: General liability (the amount of business exposed to liability)

The biggest mistake I see is incompetent agents that incorrectly classify employees for higher risk categories.
Click to expand...

Ok, the question then would be - how is it possible that if my workers already qualify for the highest possible WC payout making 20k per year, then how is it more risk to the insurance company if they make 60k per year?
If I have 5 employees then I have 5 at risk. How much money each of them makes is of no consequence. That is my question - how does how much I pay them make a difference if it is not simply to gauge how much they can squeeze out of me?

On the General liability, it's limited at 1 million. If I make 100k per year gross or 100 million per year gross, their MAX liability is 1 million. I just would like some one to explain how liability that is MAXXED at a certain amount can change in cost depending on how much I gross.

Can you help me with those two?
 
I'm only guessing but.

Like I said they have numbers on what they should be paid in their catagory. If you choose to pay 3 times the normal rate they assume they are working much longer hours thus much more exposure.

On general liability the higher your gross the more likely it is they will have to pay out the 1 million. If you gross $50K and your competition grosses $50 million who is more likely to have a $1 million payout?

I know it's warped logic or maybe no logic at all but that's the way I see it.

Remember insurance companies are the biggest bookies in the world.

They know the risk, they adjust the line and we pay it. Plus the vig.

I'm not saying it's right. Just that's the way I think they view it.
 
Insurance companies own some of the largest buildings in the world. They throw money around like crazy till a hurricane or disaster comes then they want to whine because they actually have to use the money for what it was intended.

Since 1999 (ten years) we have spent over $106,000 on all insurances except for health insurance. (vehicles, liability, WC, etc, and some of those early years we didn't even have liability or WC,)

During that time we have had:

2 small auto claims totalling $3100.00 (which I should have paid out of my pocket, but I didnt know - they tripled my insurance cost for three years for those two claims.)

1 home related claim (weather related) for $1,200.00.


Zero Workers Comp
Zero Liability
Zero Auto Claims since 2002
Zero Home Claims since 2000

Insurance is like "Deal or no Deal". If you will watch carefully you'll notice on Deal or no deal if there is a $10.00 briefcase and a $1,000,000 briefcase left the banker will come in at a $300k offer even though the chances are 50/50 and the mid mark is 500k. That's a lot of markup. Almost double.

So for the past ten years I've gotten back 4% of what I've put in on insurance claims. Meanwhile they've also collected interest on that money. (a lot more than 4%)

Of the remaining 100k I'm guessing about 10% went in the pockets of the insurance companies and the other 90k is sitting in the driveway of some co******ing lawyer in the form of a Mercedes.

Imagine how much money could be saved in this economy if Lawyers were eliminated. They are worthless anyway. Everytime I've had a lawyer involved in anything they've proven to be stupid and are just there to show a legal presence to the judge and collect a check. But I digress.

Insurance and Lawyers. I need some breakfast before I get depressed!
 
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