Tony Shelton
BS Detector, Esquire
A disclaimer at the beginning of this post:
This post is not in any way referring to the great group of contractors in the UAMCC who joined the org for the simple reasons of helping the industry, or helping their own businesses. I met some fine experienced contractors in MB who are members of the UAMCC and they have no clue as to the things that are going on at the top of the org that are rotting it from the inside out. Any characterizations below of members who have involved themselves in the behaviour outlined stops with the sheep who blindly follow the leadership and parrot their mantra without any thought and does not extend to the fine members who, like Ron and Scott Stone in the past and tens of others right now who put their trust in a leadership that has failed them. Half the guys I hung out with in MB were UAMCC members. They were a great bunch of guys. These are the guys who can lead the UAMCC into an industry force that truly is "for the contractor".
The quote of mine above is from the thread where Russ exposed Carlos' attempts to get him to join the UA*cc. I quoted my own post because something has changed since I made it.
I spoke with Carlos in person at MB for what I think was at least an hour. I asked specific questions that required simple answers. Here are three of them:
1) Why did you lie about Scott Stone and claim he left the TT for "family" reasons?
The reason for this question was to determine if the director of the UAMCC was willing to forego the truth if it in any way looked bad on the TT or the org.
The determinations would be as follows:
If the director is willing to spin a lie to "smooth things over" rather than deal with them head on, he's a poor director. If the membership was willing to accept that kind of leadership, then it is simply a poor org, with poor members with no moral convictions
If Carlos was telling the truth, then I would have to re evaluate Scott Stone and the UAMCC and offer a public apology to Carlos.
Carlos stated the Scott FIRST told him he was leaving for "personal" reasons, then later came back and told him his real reasons for leaving. (which were some distinct issues that Scott felt inappropriate. It's more heavy duty than that, but it's up to Scott if he wants to disclose the reasons. I have a feeling Scott could give two craps about the UAMCC or it's members at this point and would rather let them learn about these issues the hard way.)
Carlos (and also that weekend another TT member) further tried to discredit Scott be stating that Scott did virtually nothing as a TT member and at one time Carlos asked him to re evaluate his position there and determine if he really wanted to be a part of the TT or not. (making it look like he was the one who initiated Scott's departure weeks earlier.)
This did not sit well with me because I knew that Scott was the leading force behind the UAMCC's work with the RFP programs and Scott was also to be the environmental consultant in NC.
2)I asked Carlos believed that the decision to offer memberships to the likes of TWS was a WRONG DECISION. And if he believed offering memberships to TWS was the right way for the org to represent contractors.
Carlos informed me that the UAMCC is no longer accepting applications for service company members and had, in fact, just recently turned an application down for one.
I then asked him, that if that was the case then why wouldn't he get on the boards and offer at least some sort of admittance of wrongdoing instead of bashing everyone who disagreed with the decision. I really didn't get any real answer from Carlos to that question.
NOTE: There is a good reason for not publicly admitting this mistake - Carlos would have to buck against all the contractors who blindly followed his decision without question and stood up publicly on the board for the decision to allow TWS as a member. Admitting wrongdoing now would make his own members look like sheep who don't have the ability to determine right from wrong, but only chose to blindly "follow the leader".
3) Why did Carlos make a video and posts making Russ look like the bad guy when Russ was simply posting his conscience?
The purpose for this question was to determine what was told to Russ and what determined the choice by Carlos, the TT and future BOD members to take the stand that Russ was in the wrong for pointing out a potential problem in the org.
Carlos stated that he never told Russ any details. He was adamant the he was not in the wrong because he only hinted that there was work coming down the pike but never let on as to what it was. He also stated that he never offered anything exclusive to Russ but that Russ would have the opportunity to bid on it just like any other member.
There were other questions but these were some of the main ones.
At the end of our talk I told Carlos that I am a believer in God, and having two daughters and a son sometimes it's hard to determine who is telling the truth. My only way of doing that has been to ask God to somehow reveal who is telling the truth and eventually God reveals it. Sometimes it takes a long time, sometimes not so long, but in the end, the truth always prevails. I gave Carlos an opportunity to change or alter anything he had told me then we shook hands and I told him that IF I found that he was telling the truth I would offer him a public apology on all the boards.
Wow, did the truth come quickly.
At the end of the RT I told Ron that I wished Russ could have made it to MB. Ron suggested we drive to meet him. We met and Russ brought out credible information that not only backed up his story but further revealed the lengths Carlos had gone through to make sure he was covering himself against accusations of wrongdoing by using third parties. This information would have vindicated Russ from the beginning, but Russ kept it to himself to keep the other parties from being harmed because they didn't realize how they were being used as a pawn. It was proof. (also there was another contractor Russ mentioned on his thread who was offered specific accounts to join, but that contractor has since refused to repeat the information for fear they will be attacked the way Russ was.)
After this I spoke again with Scott Stone. Scott reminded me of something I already knew. When Scott quit the TT the first call he made was to me within minutes. He reminded me that, at that time, he repeated to me all the reasons he had told Carlos he was resigning. This was absolutely much more than "personal reasons". Carlos post came shortly after that. Then I remembered our conversation and wished I had remembered it when talking to Carlos at MB. The idea that Scott was leaving for "personal reasons" or "family reasons" is a complete fabrication designed to spin the UAMCC in a positive light. Scott also denied that Carlos had shown any indication that he thought Scott was doing nothing on the TT and brought up the question as to why Carlos would have him spearheading the NC environmental issue if he wanted him to quit.
I no longer believe this isn't about Carlos. I believe it IS about Carlos, the entire TT AND all the contractors who believe it's ok to make up fabrications, assassinate the characters of any and all who disagree with them, underhandedly release information through third parties to keep their own hands from getting dirty, and believe that an org with this type of leadership is acceptable.
After the promise to Russ how many other contractors have asked to resign and actually got their money back? I know Ron was removed from the Org and has NOT gotten his money back.
At Myrtle Beach another aspect of Carlos was revealed before I even left.
While Carlos and I were having our talk Celeste got a call from Jim Gamble. She was making a joke with a play by play of our conversation making it appear that it was a physical confrontation. (just having fun with Jim) she let him know she was joking, but for some reason he believed there was some truth in it. The next night at dinner Jim called me asking me about the "violence" that happened the night before. I could tell he had the wrong idea so I and three other guys simply played along with it. (Jim later told me he personally called and asked Carlos what happened because he took it seriously.- I have apologized to Jim for messing with him like that. We should not have done it and it was the wrong thing to do.) Of course Carlos truthfully denied there was violence, but somehow conveyed the following to a vendor at dinner - that I posted all over the boards that RON had punched Carlos and given him a black eye. (immediately upon hearing this Chris Chappell checked all the boards at the hotel computer and assured me that NO ONE had posted anything at all about Carlos or Ron or Me.) This was simply an attempt to drive a wedge between Ron and the vendor. Carlos and this vendor came in from dinner while Ron, myself, and a few others were sitting in the lobby of the hotel. There was no doubt the vendor was upset at Ron. As soon as Carlos saw that Ron and I both were sitting in the lobby he left. This was a perfect opportunity to get this thing straight instead of letting the vendor believe that Ron had something to do with this prank. (Ron had absolutely nothing to do with this and the three guys involved will all attest to that. He was completely unaware that we were doing it.) But deception hates the light of day and Carlos ran right back out and left as soon as he saw us in the lobby leaving the vendor to deal with this misperception on his own. Why would he do this? Is it proper for a leader to allow a vendor to go on with a false impression when all parties involved are all standing there in person? I may be not be a good candidate for any leadership position by showing the bad judgement I showed playing the prank with Jim, but then again, I'm not representing a national organization and I'm also willing to apologize and admit when I've done wrong. This type of rumor spreading with vendors is just the type of deception that is used all the time in regards to Ron and half the time he has had nothing to do with it. Many times the opportunity to clear it up is right there in front of the TT and they run out the door to keep from being exposed. This is pathetic. Now the vendor knows that Ron had nothing to do with it and I now realizes that this could have all been fixed in a couple of minutes if the right motives were in place.
Another disclaimer to this "across the board" judgement call is that, in spite of the fact that he's been an a$$ on occasions (I know I have too:wave3
At least two big things on the platter have been shown to have been hidden from Jeff Lecours by the other TT members and Carlos. Jeff is passionate about the UA*cc because he has put a lot of himself into it. But, Jeff, they have played you just like they've played some of the members. I have a feeling you are beginning to realize this, but you've put so much in it it's hard to allow the truth to sink in. I'm glad I'm not in your shoes. I wonder how many other TT members, potential BOD members and regular members have been left out in the dark by the few who see themselves as controlling the org?
This org could have been great for the industry. It was just started by the wrong people. Carlos is one of them.
I retract my post about this not being about Carlos. You guys who believe he can do no wrong are in for a rude awakening. He brought this on himself. He was given ample opportunity to make things right, but making things right would have potentially damaged his credibility. Damage can be repaired. But now, at least as far as I'm concerned his credibility is destroyed, beyond repair at least it is with me.
(NOTE TO CARLOS please don't try the old method of claiming I twisted your words or you didn't say this or you didn't say that. The time for saying things has been for the last 6 months right here in public, IN WRITING. You have b en provided the forum to discuss, deny, affirm, etc whatever you'd like. But you have chosen to keep your conversations at the phone level to enjoy plausible deniability. No one is going to believe any denials regarding your private conversations any more. If they do believe it, they deserve whatever destruction comes to their business from following this leadership after they have been proven time and time again to abuse the truth. The truth does not fear the light of day.)
And also Carlos, I suspect you will be mad at me forever for this post. Good. You shook my hand and lied to my face. Please stay mad. And please, stay away. You were given the opportunity to make things different. Good riddance.
In my opinion this org is bad news and a black eye :wave3: on our industry. The entire TT should be banned as members (and given their money back) for at least a year to get in fresh leaders with experience in all aspects of pressure washing (I'm not qualified, by the way). Even the new BOD nominees should be disqualified for a year because they've spent the last few months being indoctrinated via conference calls by the incompetent TT.
Otherwise it might even be a good idea to give ALL money back and start all over with a team of leaders with experience in the industry and turn it into a powerhouse of an org.
For those who think qualitative evaluation and thorough investigation of an org before endorsing it is "naysaying" I invite you to disregard everything above and enjoy the bliss of ignorance and use the prosperity you currently have until someone smarter than you takes it away from you.
Carlos may be a "good guy" to most, but to me, a "good guy" takes the good with the bad and doesn't have to spin a web to make himself look like a "good guy"
Everyone is free to decide for themselves.
This is my final decision on this matter. My "naysaying" days are over. I've just simply decided "NO" to the UAMCC and the excuses for their behavior and denials is over.
This post is not in any way referring to the great group of contractors in the UAMCC who joined the org for the simple reasons of helping the industry, or helping their own businesses. I met some fine experienced contractors in MB who are members of the UAMCC and they have no clue as to the things that are going on at the top of the org that are rotting it from the inside out. Any characterizations below of members who have involved themselves in the behaviour outlined stops with the sheep who blindly follow the leadership and parrot their mantra without any thought and does not extend to the fine members who, like Ron and Scott Stone in the past and tens of others right now who put their trust in a leadership that has failed them. Half the guys I hung out with in MB were UAMCC members. They were a great bunch of guys. These are the guys who can lead the UAMCC into an industry force that truly is "for the contractor".
The quote of mine above is from the thread where Russ exposed Carlos' attempts to get him to join the UA*cc. I quoted my own post because something has changed since I made it.
I spoke with Carlos in person at MB for what I think was at least an hour. I asked specific questions that required simple answers. Here are three of them:
1) Why did you lie about Scott Stone and claim he left the TT for "family" reasons?
The reason for this question was to determine if the director of the UAMCC was willing to forego the truth if it in any way looked bad on the TT or the org.
The determinations would be as follows:
If the director is willing to spin a lie to "smooth things over" rather than deal with them head on, he's a poor director. If the membership was willing to accept that kind of leadership, then it is simply a poor org, with poor members with no moral convictions
If Carlos was telling the truth, then I would have to re evaluate Scott Stone and the UAMCC and offer a public apology to Carlos.
Carlos stated the Scott FIRST told him he was leaving for "personal" reasons, then later came back and told him his real reasons for leaving. (which were some distinct issues that Scott felt inappropriate. It's more heavy duty than that, but it's up to Scott if he wants to disclose the reasons. I have a feeling Scott could give two craps about the UAMCC or it's members at this point and would rather let them learn about these issues the hard way.)
Carlos (and also that weekend another TT member) further tried to discredit Scott be stating that Scott did virtually nothing as a TT member and at one time Carlos asked him to re evaluate his position there and determine if he really wanted to be a part of the TT or not. (making it look like he was the one who initiated Scott's departure weeks earlier.)
This did not sit well with me because I knew that Scott was the leading force behind the UAMCC's work with the RFP programs and Scott was also to be the environmental consultant in NC.
2)I asked Carlos believed that the decision to offer memberships to the likes of TWS was a WRONG DECISION. And if he believed offering memberships to TWS was the right way for the org to represent contractors.
Carlos informed me that the UAMCC is no longer accepting applications for service company members and had, in fact, just recently turned an application down for one.
I then asked him, that if that was the case then why wouldn't he get on the boards and offer at least some sort of admittance of wrongdoing instead of bashing everyone who disagreed with the decision. I really didn't get any real answer from Carlos to that question.
NOTE: There is a good reason for not publicly admitting this mistake - Carlos would have to buck against all the contractors who blindly followed his decision without question and stood up publicly on the board for the decision to allow TWS as a member. Admitting wrongdoing now would make his own members look like sheep who don't have the ability to determine right from wrong, but only chose to blindly "follow the leader".
3) Why did Carlos make a video and posts making Russ look like the bad guy when Russ was simply posting his conscience?
The purpose for this question was to determine what was told to Russ and what determined the choice by Carlos, the TT and future BOD members to take the stand that Russ was in the wrong for pointing out a potential problem in the org.
Carlos stated that he never told Russ any details. He was adamant the he was not in the wrong because he only hinted that there was work coming down the pike but never let on as to what it was. He also stated that he never offered anything exclusive to Russ but that Russ would have the opportunity to bid on it just like any other member.
There were other questions but these were some of the main ones.
At the end of our talk I told Carlos that I am a believer in God, and having two daughters and a son sometimes it's hard to determine who is telling the truth. My only way of doing that has been to ask God to somehow reveal who is telling the truth and eventually God reveals it. Sometimes it takes a long time, sometimes not so long, but in the end, the truth always prevails. I gave Carlos an opportunity to change or alter anything he had told me then we shook hands and I told him that IF I found that he was telling the truth I would offer him a public apology on all the boards.
Wow, did the truth come quickly.
At the end of the RT I told Ron that I wished Russ could have made it to MB. Ron suggested we drive to meet him. We met and Russ brought out credible information that not only backed up his story but further revealed the lengths Carlos had gone through to make sure he was covering himself against accusations of wrongdoing by using third parties. This information would have vindicated Russ from the beginning, but Russ kept it to himself to keep the other parties from being harmed because they didn't realize how they were being used as a pawn. It was proof. (also there was another contractor Russ mentioned on his thread who was offered specific accounts to join, but that contractor has since refused to repeat the information for fear they will be attacked the way Russ was.)
After this I spoke again with Scott Stone. Scott reminded me of something I already knew. When Scott quit the TT the first call he made was to me within minutes. He reminded me that, at that time, he repeated to me all the reasons he had told Carlos he was resigning. This was absolutely much more than "personal reasons". Carlos post came shortly after that. Then I remembered our conversation and wished I had remembered it when talking to Carlos at MB. The idea that Scott was leaving for "personal reasons" or "family reasons" is a complete fabrication designed to spin the UAMCC in a positive light. Scott also denied that Carlos had shown any indication that he thought Scott was doing nothing on the TT and brought up the question as to why Carlos would have him spearheading the NC environmental issue if he wanted him to quit.
I no longer believe this isn't about Carlos. I believe it IS about Carlos, the entire TT AND all the contractors who believe it's ok to make up fabrications, assassinate the characters of any and all who disagree with them, underhandedly release information through third parties to keep their own hands from getting dirty, and believe that an org with this type of leadership is acceptable.
After the promise to Russ how many other contractors have asked to resign and actually got their money back? I know Ron was removed from the Org and has NOT gotten his money back.
At Myrtle Beach another aspect of Carlos was revealed before I even left.
While Carlos and I were having our talk Celeste got a call from Jim Gamble. She was making a joke with a play by play of our conversation making it appear that it was a physical confrontation. (just having fun with Jim) she let him know she was joking, but for some reason he believed there was some truth in it. The next night at dinner Jim called me asking me about the "violence" that happened the night before. I could tell he had the wrong idea so I and three other guys simply played along with it. (Jim later told me he personally called and asked Carlos what happened because he took it seriously.- I have apologized to Jim for messing with him like that. We should not have done it and it was the wrong thing to do.) Of course Carlos truthfully denied there was violence, but somehow conveyed the following to a vendor at dinner - that I posted all over the boards that RON had punched Carlos and given him a black eye. (immediately upon hearing this Chris Chappell checked all the boards at the hotel computer and assured me that NO ONE had posted anything at all about Carlos or Ron or Me.) This was simply an attempt to drive a wedge between Ron and the vendor. Carlos and this vendor came in from dinner while Ron, myself, and a few others were sitting in the lobby of the hotel. There was no doubt the vendor was upset at Ron. As soon as Carlos saw that Ron and I both were sitting in the lobby he left. This was a perfect opportunity to get this thing straight instead of letting the vendor believe that Ron had something to do with this prank. (Ron had absolutely nothing to do with this and the three guys involved will all attest to that. He was completely unaware that we were doing it.) But deception hates the light of day and Carlos ran right back out and left as soon as he saw us in the lobby leaving the vendor to deal with this misperception on his own. Why would he do this? Is it proper for a leader to allow a vendor to go on with a false impression when all parties involved are all standing there in person? I may be not be a good candidate for any leadership position by showing the bad judgement I showed playing the prank with Jim, but then again, I'm not representing a national organization and I'm also willing to apologize and admit when I've done wrong. This type of rumor spreading with vendors is just the type of deception that is used all the time in regards to Ron and half the time he has had nothing to do with it. Many times the opportunity to clear it up is right there in front of the TT and they run out the door to keep from being exposed. This is pathetic. Now the vendor knows that Ron had nothing to do with it and I now realizes that this could have all been fixed in a couple of minutes if the right motives were in place.
Another disclaimer to this "across the board" judgement call is that, in spite of the fact that he's been an a$$ on occasions (I know I have too:wave3
At least two big things on the platter have been shown to have been hidden from Jeff Lecours by the other TT members and Carlos. Jeff is passionate about the UA*cc because he has put a lot of himself into it. But, Jeff, they have played you just like they've played some of the members. I have a feeling you are beginning to realize this, but you've put so much in it it's hard to allow the truth to sink in. I'm glad I'm not in your shoes. I wonder how many other TT members, potential BOD members and regular members have been left out in the dark by the few who see themselves as controlling the org? This org could have been great for the industry. It was just started by the wrong people. Carlos is one of them.
I retract my post about this not being about Carlos. You guys who believe he can do no wrong are in for a rude awakening. He brought this on himself. He was given ample opportunity to make things right, but making things right would have potentially damaged his credibility. Damage can be repaired. But now, at least as far as I'm concerned his credibility is destroyed, beyond repair at least it is with me.
(NOTE TO CARLOS please don't try the old method of claiming I twisted your words or you didn't say this or you didn't say that. The time for saying things has been for the last 6 months right here in public, IN WRITING. You have b en provided the forum to discuss, deny, affirm, etc whatever you'd like. But you have chosen to keep your conversations at the phone level to enjoy plausible deniability. No one is going to believe any denials regarding your private conversations any more. If they do believe it, they deserve whatever destruction comes to their business from following this leadership after they have been proven time and time again to abuse the truth. The truth does not fear the light of day.)
And also Carlos, I suspect you will be mad at me forever for this post. Good. You shook my hand and lied to my face. Please stay mad. And please, stay away. You were given the opportunity to make things different. Good riddance.
In my opinion this org is bad news and a black eye :wave3: on our industry. The entire TT should be banned as members (and given their money back) for at least a year to get in fresh leaders with experience in all aspects of pressure washing (I'm not qualified, by the way). Even the new BOD nominees should be disqualified for a year because they've spent the last few months being indoctrinated via conference calls by the incompetent TT.
Otherwise it might even be a good idea to give ALL money back and start all over with a team of leaders with experience in the industry and turn it into a powerhouse of an org.
For those who think qualitative evaluation and thorough investigation of an org before endorsing it is "naysaying" I invite you to disregard everything above and enjoy the bliss of ignorance and use the prosperity you currently have until someone smarter than you takes it away from you.
Carlos may be a "good guy" to most, but to me, a "good guy" takes the good with the bad and doesn't have to spin a web to make himself look like a "good guy"
Everyone is free to decide for themselves.
This is my final decision on this matter. My "naysaying" days are over. I've just simply decided "NO" to the UAMCC and the excuses for their behavior and denials is over.
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