PWNA LOOKING for MOds

Ron I see only one problem with saying you must be a member in order to be a moderator, what if no member wants to offer his or her time in the forums open.

Would they then consider non-members as Mods?

Don't read into this as to me, I am just asking a simple question here.


Jon
 
Jon,
I answered the PWNA post that Ron started about the PWNA looking for moderators. I am a PWNA member and now a moderator there.

TO me it only makes sense that a person there should be a PWNA member to be considered for a moderator position on there bb.

Why would they want someone who doesn't believe in being a member of the PWNA? That bb is there I would imagine to help fellow powerwashers and to also strengthen the PWNA. At least that is my take on it.

You of course would be an excellent moderator on there site but if you don't believe at this time that you want to be a PWNA member then why would they want you to be on there team?

Its like being a union representative for a bunch of guys but you don't believe in the union. Where's the logic on that??

Of course this is just my opinion and I don't even know if you have to be a PWNA member to moderate there site. I'm sure its posted somewhere on there site and I missed it. If not e-mail one of there board members such as Mike Hughes and see if he can answer your questions.
 
"Why would they want someone who doesn't believe in being a member of the PWNA? That bb is there I would imagine to help fellow powerwashers and to also strengthen the PWNA. At least that is my take on it. "

At first when I read this I told myself just let it go-but I just can't. Just because my views on PWNA aren't shall we say PC enough, I still have a say thank you. I have a company to run, and this does not include spending all day answering the same questions. We have no need for another slow bb that would drain from the other bb.

I have spoke with Chris regarding what I would like to see at PWNA and some of my issues will be addressed. I will not be in lock step with PWNA if I feel the direction is not in the best interest of my company.

David
 
To me it doesn't matter but just b/c they,them are members doesn't mean they,them are smarter then some of the pro's that run the broads.

As pro's why should they help in answering Q'tions if culled for not being a member,not ever smart in my book.I have nothing againest a group of people trying to change the world,that means all groups.Maybe all NON-members should abandon that site and seek help elsewhere if you haveta have a black tie to get in as a mod,honey comes from the works you know.

I can wear a black tie if need be or wear a pair of holy levis as my mood would be different in both but the helping would always be from the heart in both.

IFEN I wanted to odey the yes sirs and no sirs I'd joint my un'le Sam and climb the ladder for my stars but being a member to a group just to be a mod hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha,I dream of the real world tho *LOL*.
 
It was just my take on it as far as the PWNA bb is concerned which of course doesn't mean its right.

There is a part of that bb that non members can't read because its for members only. I have no problem with that for a couple of reasons which are: Its there bb and they can do what they want as in any other bb and I am a paying member and a member should have a couple of more privledges or why be a member at all. We also get discounts at the Conventions for classes.

Do we get enough for being a member? Probably not as of yet but I will help support this organization so maybe one day it could be all that it could be and then some.

Other bb's have certain things that I don't like such as not being able to go into another persons profile to see what there about and to possibly e-mail them etc. but thats life.

So don't take it personal if the PWNA says that you have to be a member to be a moderator. It doesn't make anyone smarter then the next person but it is following the rules which they as in anyother bb can make.

If the PWNA says anyone can be a moderator I would have no problem with that but if they said that members and non members have all the same privledges all thu-out then I wouldn't be a member. Why piss away money if you get nothing out of it. Which some people I'm sure feel that way about the PWNA as in any other organization.

Hopefully in the future there will be alot more people in this Industry that support the PWNA which supports us.

But as the old saying goes no matter what is done "You can please some of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all the time".
 
Oh bOy,

Do you think I need the Pwna or this BBS for all that matters? NO

I do what I do because I simply believe our industry is light years behind. If the standard and professionalism are raise I can make more money.


Gentlemen it’s that’s simple, some of you believe that helping your neighbor is going to put you out of business. (If that’s what you believe then you should get into another line of work) I loose and win battle everyday. That’s part of doing business.

Big businesses and small business share ideas in every field that is what makes the industry grow and achieve higher goals.

John is doing his part and I will stand right by anyone else that truly wants to help. New or veterans can help. This organization under Chris Detter is going to raise the standards. We will all be making more money because a few people are taking the time to make this industry better. Help


These BBS are all about helping, its frustrating when I see posts that are exactly opposite. Even worse I see leaders in this industry talking about gee another new guy that’s all we need. Its not about the new guy, he wont steal your business. if he does then it really wasn’t yours.

I think standards need to be set, without an organization to be a foundation for all to look then we will never have a foundation. Sure some are afraid of Government intervention. If we do not organize now later we will have no voice.

The things I’m talking about are not one year away they are 10 years away and need to start rolling now or they are going to be 50 years away.


I realize my opinion is a minority, that’s OK because I know I’m right on this one. LOL why would my passion on this BBS that I don’t make a nickel on be so strong if that where not my stand!!!!!!!!


Remember I don’t ask or make a cent for this BBS, actually its cost me thousands. Not monetarily but my own time could be focused elsewhere. I don’t complain but when I see guys that don’t have a clue its rub’s me the wrong way.

David S. Nothing in this post is directed at you, you give more than you receive everyday. I agree with you and respect your decision. Maybe after I have been down the road you have traveled I will have another opinion. I keep you advice and opinion close. For now I’m taking my shot to see what can happen. I know that you agree with some of my points and just think they cannot get the job done. Maybe you’re right?

To everyone else, This was not directed at anyone specifically. Bigboy don’t take any offense…LOL
 
Gee Ron I thought you said you were on VACATION:D

I need to talk to your wife and ask her to hide that darn laptop so you can enjoy the family and forget about any and all BBS for a week.

I simply asked a simple question and did not expect it to be blown up.

Ok the PWNA has a private forum for members only and I see nothing wrong there.

Now the open forums is what I am referring to, if NOT enough PWNA members with the expertise in a given field do not offer up their services as Moderators why not say we can ask non members to help.

That was/is my point and don't take it to mean I want to be one, I don't have the time anymore to take it on. Does not mean I will not go and post.

Hey Bigboy Ronnie boy is begging you to get on his butt. Critic his post man, and don't be no sissy about it either.
 
I may need to wait until I get my car and badge,then I could drive around with free gas plus play with the blue lights.

I've throwed afew dimes at him but he's only throwing nickels back,I came close stirring his pot here while back but I was ready for him *LOL*.

Like I said it doesn't matter to me,whats being a mod so important.I've been a mod on Dan's and Ron's bbs and its the easiest job I've ever had,may as will let a guess be a mod nomore then they are needed.

I think its stupid,a newbee can pay his due's and now he's a mod haha.I think the PWNA should be looking for people like David and Jon not newbee's which comes from people like David and Jon.

I will agree John its their wagen,they can put and hook anything they want.Like Scott said tho death may come to it if only members go there and ifen they don't market it and to market it they have to look for non-members for the PWNA.

"""""privledges"""""hahaha to me that only means your limited as to what you can and can not do.

Luckyboy maybe next time I'll push his button awittle harder but I've got to go back to work........C-ya
 
I have a great idea on how to market the PWNA, but it takes money and I doubt they would want to pay to do what I have in mind.

Just how much it would cost to do I honestly cannot say but it is not my idea, not even a new idea for that matter and many do this now to gain accounts.

Key word: Marketing

Listen up PWNA as here it is, all you need to do is reach every pressure washer out there all over the world, many from other countries do log into some or all of the BBS.

Hire a company to check every city, country and state for every registered pressure washer and send them information on the PWNA.

Yellow pages, business license departments, for the states that require it the contractors board.

Do your marking, follow up, call, send another mailer, send some sort of discout coupon if they join for two years.

But as many say get some benefits to offer both the current members and any new ones.

Would it work, good question, like those that send out flyers or put them on doors you will get a percentage of them yes, how many I could not even venture a guess.

Contact all old members, find out what it would take to get them back, offer them something too.

There is no secrect formula to getting members to join any org. if the benefits are there and if it can be shown it pays to be a member.

Run some sort of advertising in major papers and other trade magazines, Restaurant Orgs. Fleet Orgs, painters, property management, uniforms, delivery services and the list goes on and on.

Talk about what the PWNA is in relation to the pressure washer.

Ok guys I know it sounds like your going to have your toes stepped on by the PWNA pushing members to be hired to clean all that stuff but is that not part of what it is about?

If your not known how do you expect to gain members? For every one of us who knows about the PWNA I would say here are hundreds that don't know about it, even thousands. I am not talking about the fly by nighters or low ballers who don't even have insurance or a business name or insurance.

I am talking about the upfront legal companies, be it a one man operation or 25 man company.

Enough said.

Jon
 
This was my ideas that I expressed to Chris!

1. I would double the dues. Why? because half the membership will go south(quit).

2. Require from the member insurance, workers comp, liability insurance, and certifications. Require these items on application.

3. One meeting per year.

4. Must attend one meeting every two years.

5. No benefits. Why????? Because they don't have the membership to get good programs. Two reasons, number of members plus they don't buy anything that mounts to anything.

6. Make a meaningful membership that the members can strive to maintain.

In short the membership now is open to all whoever has $250-and it means nothing. Why should I spend $3000 plus to go to a show-tell me. Yes I am a member and Certified.

David
 
I'm home for a couple days, I will be heading back on sunday.

Jon i wasnt picking on anyone. I did like your last post. positive advice. David your was too. I think they could use both you guys. Too bad you been spoiled by past adminstration.

I like and believe Chris is trying. until i see different i will support the new Guys.

Maybe we can get some more new guys in next year.
 
David,
I always appreciate the insight you bring to these bb's from your past experiences. With that said and using these bb's like a conversation board I can't say I agree with you about some of the Idea's you brought up to Chris.

1. Your point here about raising the dues doesn't make sense to me. Why? Well for two reasons.#1 Why not even raise it higher then what you said so more of the members can quit and the one's remaining would be the real hard core group. I don't see the logic in that. and #2 Instead of raising the membership how about trying to find a way to lower it so we can have MORE members. Because besides strength that comes with money strength also comes with People. And the more they have the stronger the PWNA will get.(I believe awhile back Jon brought up the point about lowering the membership which I agreed to but knew the PWNA would'nt go for it)

2. Makes sense

3. Why only one meeting per year? What happens if someone can't make that meeting and he really wanted to go? I am assuming that you mean conventions. If not then what meeting are you talking about??

4.Interesting but if your a paying member and you choose not to go to a meeting why should the PWNA boot you out? Its free money to them. Like a Health spa that everybody joins and stop going. Easy money for them.

5. Your point here is contradicting your first point above.

6. Agreed, but how do they attain that??? That is the Million $$ question.

And your closing sentence about $250 and you get nothing. Debatable but I see your point. That is why if they make people pay $500 like your saying above it won't work. It would be great if they can double there membership for lets say $150yr/membership that way there are more members and the PWNA has a couple of more $$ and if one goes to the conventions and takes classes then he is actually saving money to the point of breaking even and being a member of a group (PWNA) that supports us.

David I would like to here what you have to say about the points I brought up. Through bb's like this one here maybe we can break ground and come up with great Idea's by brainstorming which is the reason why I would like to see you respond here.

Thanks
 
The management group of PWNA must make money with less membership the dues would have to be raised to cover the short fall. Quality member are better than quantity. If PWNA required it's member to have insurance, workers comp and so on-how many would not pass muster?

The no benefit section-means just that-no benefits-why pretend-will never happen. They will have lots of puff programs and no meat. It's not the fault of PWNA, and I am sure they have done what they can. The members are a group just don't buy what is required of certain vendors. NFPA for example does not offer its members benefits, that I know of.

We can't even get into a CETA show as a member of PWNA. My workers comp went up TODAY from $13.04 to $18.44 per $100 and PWNA sent me a US Government brochure called "The ocean begins at your front door". Your life and mine would be much better if the members of PWNA were of quality cleaners that are able to make changes.

Jon and I differ on lowering the dues-why? If a person has a problem with $250-how on earth is going to be able to attend the shows. One show per year is plenty-hell most groupd meet once per year/Doctors/Pharmacy Groups/Cops/Firemen and so on.

Its late

David
 
Bigboy said:

I think its stupid,a newbee can pay his due's and now he's a mod haha.I think the PWNA should be looking for people like David and Jon not newbee's which comes from people like David and Jon.
Click to expand...


Who said anything about newbies being mods?? Wouldn't that be like the blind leading the blind?
 
Sometimes the blind can see better than the people with big open eyes balls,guess it would depend on what you was looking at OR feeling at the time ;).

In a statement on the pwna bbs it only said you had to be a member to be a mod.Wouldn't a newbee be a member if he paid his due's,are you saying now he cann't be a mod,so all members aren't treated the same.Where did his privledges go,hasn't he how the right to do so b/c he's a member :rolleyes: .

How about part'timers thaT are members,can they also mod or do they have to be fultimers.Isn't rules and privledges fun to play with when you can push and pull the buttons.Besides how long do you have to be in business before your no longer called a newbee,one month,1 year,why not make it a rule you have to be in 5 years before your no longer a newbee :D.

Alot of the pro's on the bbs's have more years in knowledge than some of the members of the pwna,looks like that would be the people the pwna would be after,their knowledge would greatly help move the pwna toward their outlook :confused:

The more you shove the non-member pro's outlook out the back door,the longer its going to take the pwna to realize thats where the rules and privledges start.There is nothing I cann't do as a non-member in the powerwashing feild,I can use their rules and privledges to my likeing :eek: .

Like I said I have nothing againest a group trying to change the world and take on the outlook as if your not on their side giveing money they don't need you nomatter have much knowledge you have but will take anything free from you.

Will the freedom of speech get my head cut off as it has others,hehe,like I said it doesn't matter to me. :p
 
OK, John’s on to something,, magical question. How do we change and make the membership grow.

I think lowering dues are the answer. I think numbers are more important than quality at this point.

#1 reason is that the average cleaning contractor is no millionaire. (Average guy grosses about 55,000)
#2 we need more distributors involved. (You will only get them with numbers)
#3 distributors make more money selling to new guys. (That’s a fact)

Everyone talks about contractors and the PWNA.. In any trade organization it’s not about trade members but the dollars and revenue the distributors make. These are the people that should be carrying the burden. We as a group have made companies like C-tech. Hotsy alladdin and others.

As contractors help me make them support our industry. This is really the question, it’s about dollars they can make. Dues will never cover the cost of organizing this body. Distributor support is what is needed, in order to obtain this we need numbers. Lots of numbers, body's are people with buying power.

I sometimes wonder if the entire Board realizes this or not. we have one insurance person on the PWNA.

Here are some questions I like to ask. I’m sure he is a good man. But do we need a person with a conflict that’s has nothing to do with pressure washing on the Board of directors? If I start soliciting other insurance carriers tomorrow about booth space will they feel comfortable joining this organization?

In the past we have had a major player distributor Delco Cleaning systems and now Chris Detter with sunbrite. I think Chris thinks clearly and so did Robert. But when your standing outside the Box its dark trying to see in. perception can be a funny thing.

Should solely contractors run this organization? My mind is not made up…. I don’t know the answer to my own question yet.



We need more distributors, large ones. And lots of little one this would cure the money problems.

Contractors will not be able to support this, in all the organization across the board it is funded by the distributors. Millions of dollars should come from these folks and someone should start demanding they support. We can do it right here, the pwna site should charge the Bigboys 10,000 or more for a banner. the reason I think this could be done is one of these distributor made and offer for PWI for close to that amount. They will pay if they se its getting the traffic. if they sell two machines they made money. Do the numbers. They make millions.

the magical answer is we need more distributors, ist a joke we only have a few. we are a national org. we should have hundreds. Maybe 450 with a contractor membership of 4000 that’s 200,000 in dist and 1,000,000.00 in contrator. That’s how you’ll get more members.

What’s the buying power of this group? About 8,000,000.00 average ticket annually of 2000.00

present buying power 80,000
 
Moderators

PWNA has set up the BBS to help educating members and nonmembers alike. Since the BBS is a direct extension of the association then those that moderate on it should be members in good standing. Moderators should also be knowledgeable professional in their fields. Hopefully, members and nonmembers alike will benefit from the page.

Since PWNA began our primary focus has always been education. The BBS only help to do this.

I have seen some other good comments here on the thread and I will try to respond to them. Sorry I only have time for a couple.

YES WE DO NEED MORE DISTRIBUTORS, SUPPLIERS AND MANUFACTURES. Whether most of you realize it or not, a lot of distributors dislike PWNA because they consider it to be a threat to their market share. Not all think this way but a large majority does. They see PWNA as a place where contactors can meet there competition. This only makes it harder for us to get the word out about the association. Consider this quote from the movie Vanilla Sky "99 percent of all decision come down to one thing...........MONEY” This may be a good topic for a separate thread. And I will gladly participate and share my insight.

As a board member of PWNA we have discussed Raising and Lowering dues several times. There a many arguments to support both sides.

Requiring insurance for membership may be a little much. It contradicts our ability to educate the newbies. I don't recall of the top of my head but I think this may be a requirement for certification if not I would support it.

We are currently planning on going to one big show a year. Our hope is that this will draw more exhibitors and participants to a single event.

Benefits - this could also be another thread. This is a bit of a tough one because it really depends on what you consider a benefit to be. Do you want multiple discount programs or do you think networking with your peers is more valuable. I personally have found networking with my peers to be very valuable.

There is a new phenomena, if you so choose, that has slowed the growth of PWNA. Believe it or not it is the Internet. The internet has create or made possible the creation of the "FreeLanders". There is some much on the internet the can be gotten for FREE, especially information. FreeLanders expect to some degree the same thing form the association. And it is just not possible.

Finally, it bothers me to see anyone put off by PWNA. Most the time I think it is a lack of information that causes this. I will try to help as much as I can. And anyone can email me anytime on any subject mike@steamaway.com or call me 817-401-1684 on my mobile.
 
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