KEC and NFPA 96

RMedbery

RMedbery

banned
The Grease Police has been formed out of necessity. We have bodies that make the "laws"(NFPA 96) of our industry (IKECA, Phil Ackland, NFPA) but there has never been anyone willing to enforce these "laws". The Grease Police have decided to take this on.

As far as the picture taking goes, in order to be the enforcers of the laws, we have to prove that we know and abide by them ourselves. I do it on every one of my jobs and it only takes a few more minutes.

We fully understand the importance of certification in our industry, and each Grease Police member is required to be certified, however GPA is not a certifying body. Certification is only a step to becoming a professional (characterized by or conforming to the technical or ethical standards of a profession) hood cleaner. Actually performing the work properly is the next step. We are here to make sure that you do this.

You don't have to be a member of GPA to call yourself a professional, but you do have to follow the rules layed down by the professionals in our industry (IKECA, Phil Ackland). If you don't, we will be there to catch you. You may get away with your crimes today, but in the end you are going to get caught.
 
Ron a digital camera can be had for around a hundred buck, the pictures from then on are free, unless you print them, and I guess you could argue the cost of batteries. It's not really an issue in your case, but in KEC most of the work is out of sight, and unfortunately way to many people take advantage of that.
 
There is an unfortunate situation in our industry, much like the auto repair industry, where companies that call themselves professionals, are in fact bilking their customers. This creates a bad reputation for hood cleaners everywhere. I am not talking about the "rag and tag" companies, these are the guys that are easy to spot, I am talking about established, and even certified companies, that are holding themselves out as professionals, all the while they are performing work that does not meet NFPA 96 standards.

Take a look at the slide show below. This is a company that is certified by a nationally recognized kitchen exhaust cleaning organization. They performed their service weeks prior, and the fire department happened to be there when the fire suppression service was being performed. When the filter was removed to change the link, the FD got a look at the ducts and told the restaurant owner that it had not been cleaned properly, and to have it done right. Now in this instance, the FD has an opportunity to see substandard work from a company that is certified by a nationally recognized kitchen exhaust cleaning organization. What kind of picture is that going to paint for the FD?

<div><embed src="http://widget-e9.slide.com/widgets/slideticker.swf" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" quality="high" scale="noscale" salign="l" wmode="transparent" flashvars="cy=lt&il=1&channel=72057594049211113&site=widget-e9.slide.com" style="width:426px;height:320px" name="flashticker" align="middle"></embed><div style="width:426px;text-align:left;"><a href="http://www.slide.com/pivot?cy=lt&ad=0&id=72057594049211113&map=1" target="_blank"><img src="http://widget-e9.slide.com/p1/72057594049211113/lt_t024_v000_a000_f00/images/xslide1.gif" border="0" ismap="ismap" /></a> <a href="http://www.slide.com/pivot?cy=lt&ad=0&id=72057594049211113&map=2" target="_blank"><img src="http://widget-e9.slide.com/p2/72057594049211113/lt_t024_v000_a000_f00/images/xslide2.gif" border="0" ismap="ismap" /></a></div></div>

Something has to be done. The Grease Police have decided to take on the task of enforcing the standards layed out by industry professional like IKECA and Phil Ackland. We fully understand the difficulty of this task, yet we are willing to spend time away from outside of our normal tasks to see that it is done.

We can all just do our jobs and go along our merry way, or we can stand up for what we feel is right regardless of who may be against us.
 
And by what color of authority gives you the power to police this industry? The AHJ's (Fire Dept./Ins.Co) have the power. You and you group have no authority over any hood cleaner, other than your group.

A group should police itself so that the standards are maintained. Good tool to gain new accounts in needed markets.
 
Chris, I'm not agaist what you propose. I just know that documenting things costs money.

If a company has a good system of verification they will reduce the cost of what i read about the photos.

If all the documentation is what bryans say will be held inside a digital camera then i see that will be cost efffective but bot very good.

I run a business and I know what the costs of managing people and processes Cost.

I wish you luck and i'm sorry that i find it hard to believe that photos will be taken at each and every location.

I would not document or follow such a program if i was washing myself. I will do the job right and i can rely on myself to do this.

I understand the pricipal behind what your purposing.
 
Chris

The FD did its job and you picked up a new account. That cleaner is held to task by the account and the FD. What would the Grease Police do? I don't think that this program is well thought out. The Grease Police is at the door-that in itself to some could be representing a color of authority, just by the use of the name.

I would get a legal look see.
 
Sounds like Ed is scared hell be brought out.

Ron, I take an average of about 20 pics of EVERY job. My hands on the cam time (at the job) is about 60 seconds 90 max. Maybe another 60 to 90 seconds to download them to a PC. Wheres the big cost?

Funny, the people that have a problem with taking pics to show proof of thier good work are the ones that dont do it already....................fraid someone may see something?
 
RMedbery said:
Funny, the people that have a problem with taking pics to show proof of thier good work are the ones that dont do it already....................fraid someone may see something?
Click to expand...

That same subject came up today discussing roof cleaning....

You exhaust guys have a disgusting job to complete, I applaud you.
 
David Saulque said:
And by what color of authority gives you the power to police this industry? The AHJ's (Fire Dept./Ins.Co) have the power. You and you group have no authority over any hood cleaner, other than your group.

A group should police itself so that the standards are maintained. Good tool to gain new accounts in needed markets.
Click to expand...

We have absolutley no power. It may take a while but in time you will be brought out. Negative word of mouth travels like California wild fires.
 
The Grease Police are set up as a reporting arm to the AHJ's and certifying organizations. We have not reinvented the wheel in that we are not certifying hood cleaners, just making sure hood cleaners are upholding professional standards in our industry. We have as much authority as any organization would have. The police in our society do not judge, they simply find those who are breaking the laws, and turn them over to be judge. That is all we are set up to do; turn in hood cleaners who are breaking kitchen exhaust cleaning laws (NFPA 96).

As for picture taking, I can not see where it would be needed in an exterior cleaning profession, as anyone can see by the light of day whether the job was done right. Hood cleaners have a unique situation where we are expected to hold ourselves up to a certain ethical standard, with absolutely no supervision whatsoever. This allows unscrupulous characters to remain in our profession and thrive off of their thievery, and even be seen as industry leaders, when they know full well that they are negligent.

Buildings are burning, people have died, because of these criminals.

IKECA, Phil Ackland, CHDCA and the PWNA have all done excellent jobs of training individuals, as well as the AHJ's, on proper hood cleaning. It is now time for somebody to make sure that anyone calling himself a hood cleaner, uphold the standards that have been set by these bodies.
 
Sounds like Ed is scared hell be brought out.
Click to expand...

Ed said some things that are out of line and i called him and told him about it.

Please don’t make stuff up or insinuate he or anyone else is doing a bad job unless you have the photos.

Being a part of and organization that’s trying to better the industry is that. Telling others they are scared of what they do them self is cowardly.

People who are actually afraid they have something that doesn’t work make and talk about what others are not doing.

I never talk about what my competition is not doing but what I can do correct and educate them about the product and service.


The TGP guys are proud there’s not doubt, I commend them for the efforts.

Please do not attack anyone personally here because they don’t agree with your ways.

I here some of you say more than one way to skin a cat. Then on the same token there only the TGP way.

I’m confused and really it’s pretty interesting because I don’t believe you have all founding member on the same page yet.
 
Ron Musgraves said:
WHo and where? can you actually prove this was a KEC guys fault?
Click to expand...

http://www.propowerwash.com/board/upload/showthread.php?t=9224

Tougher standards are on the table when it comes to getting rid of grease in Boston restaurants after two Boston firefighters died in a West Roxbury restaurant fire last month.

NewsCenter 5's Steve Lacy reported that there is currently no certification process in Boston for companies involved in grease cleaning. Critics have argued that has led to an unregulated industry that is open to just about anyone, regardless of whether they have the training required to do the job properly.

A preliminary investigation indicated that it was a grease buildup in a kitchen exhaust pipe that caused the fire that killed two Boston firefighters, Warren Payne and Paul Cahill, at the Tai Ho restaurant on Centre Street last month. The fire occurred despite the fact that the restuarant had its vents cleaned just two months earlier.
 
Police in the State of California receive their power from the California Penal Code. To say that the Grease Police will be given powers by the AHJ is simply ridiculous. AHJ’s are in constant jurisdictions fights each and every day. For example some can’t tell you what year NFPA 96 they are working on. In short the AHJ’s are the ones with the power to enforce fire code. I would doubt that the Grease Police would be well accepted by the AHJ national community.
 
Being an owner of a company that has been around for 27 years is a challenge and to think that my crews are not giving their best is not a good feeling. We as owner strive to make that a positive issue. We weed out the bad employees and move on. We make it right with the customer and re do the job. I encourage owners to check our work and call us on issues that are improper.

As an industry I think we do as well as other service industries. Talk to other owners of other industries and they have the same problems as we do. This is not to say we can’t improve.

We need to empower the owners to check work before they pay for it and to call for service when issues come up. NFPA 96 2001 11.4.2-2004 4.1.5 states-“The responsibility for inspection, maintenance, & cleanliness of the ventilation control & fire protection of the commercial cooking operation shall be the ultimate responsibility of the owner of the system.”
 
Good Employees are hard to find... I offer my employees 20 % of a cleaning Job and I usually go on all the jobs.. I do have a guy that does fire equipment accounts for me he makes 40% , he uses his own vehicle and gas. This guy does about $400 to $700 a week.. I however pay him at least $250.00 a week.. regardless.. I still do all the harder hood cleaning jobs myself , well because I have done it so long and I dont trust people with my machine... Starting next month I am going to have to buy another truck , machine , etc.. and put another crew on the road to do about 52 accounts every 4 to 6 months.. I am really worried about this...
 
David Saulque said:
Police in the State of California receive their power from the California Penal Code. To say that the Grease Police will be given powers by the AHJ is simply ridiculous. AHJ’s are in constant jurisdictions fights each and every day. For example some can’t tell you what year NFPA 96 they are working on. In short the AHJ’s are the ones with the power to enforce fire code. I would doubt that the Grease Police would be well accepted by the AHJ national community.
Click to expand...

David, I think you are still misunderstanding. TGP has no, nor do I believe they are seeking ANY official POWER to do anything.


Ron Musgraves said:
2 m0nths 2days. still would be fuel.
Click to expand...

Ah, but if cleaned properly per NFPA standards, if a fire were to break out the suppression system (if also properly maintained) would have no problem extinguishing the fire.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top