How long are we going to allow this to go on?

Tony Shelton

Tony Shelton

BS Detector, Esquire
People are whining about the "rights" of illegals and their "fear" of "profiling". Yet we subject our own citizens to the horrendous jack booted thug techniques shown by the video below.

Our governments from federal down to local are strained financially. Yet we continue to waste money on the so-called "war on drugs".

Some genius prosecutor got a warrant for this guy's house where they found a "grinder, a pipe and a small amount of marijuana". They put his kids through hell in the middle of the night and killed one dog and shot the other.

For what? Because the guy chooses to smoke pot rather than drink alcohol? Or maybe he likes both? Who cares?

It's none of our business.

It's not even our business if he does it in his house with his kids there. It's HIS house and HIS kids. How many millions of kids grew up in homes with alcoholic parents yet somehow they survived!!!? Usually they don't even become drinkers because of it!!

What if it was cocaine? NONE OF OUR BUSINESS. Tobacco - NONE OF OUR BUSINESS. Meth - NONE OF OUR BUSINESS.

If the police were only allowed to prosecute real CRIMES against other people and property instead of manufactured crimes that are only crimes to help politicians get elected they would have plenty of time to PATROL the streets and STOP THE REAL CRIMES being committed by the meth addicts and coke addicts.

Robbery, burglary, theft, assault. These are crimes against other people.

Look at all the effort put into this puny drug bust (for amounts that won't even get you a written citation here in Las Vegas) but yet when your home is robbed they will tell YOU to come down to the station and fill out a report!!!!!!!!!!

What has happened to the people of this country?

How long before some politician determines that bacon isn't good for you and outlaws it? They will cite all the heart attacks and how much it costs the government in unpaid hospital bills ad nauseum. Till one day they turn the dumb sheep against bacon and you'll have to worry about these morons kicking down your door because a neighbor smelled your favorite morning breakfast.

Do you think that is absurd? It's already happening with tobacco.


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Outrageous. All for what, a personal amount of weed ? Shot the dog(s) ???? I watched the video to the end, and am very grateful I did not have to see the poor dogs that suffered the police brutality.

Thanks for making me (us) aware of this Tony, but to be honest this is going to be disturbing to me for quite some time.
 
This is one issue that is more the fault of the republicans than the democrats. They've used fear and their "hard line" stance on drugs to keep getting elected over and over again by those who believe it is their religious duty to regulate everyone else's bad habits through legislation.

Where does it end? Are we to regulate gluttony? If so I have a feeling that 90% of the politicians and the religious political zealots would quickly find themselves on the wrong side of the law.

What people do in their own homes (to themselves) is NONE OF OUR BUSINESS.

It's time to get rid of the entire bunch of losers who have spent their lives doing nothing more productive than running for office over and over again.

It's time to stand up for our rights as citizens and get the government out of our houses and out of our pursuit of happiness. (no matter how misguided that pursuit may be)
 
Tony Shelton said:
This is one issue that is more the fault of the republicans than the democrats. They've used fear and their "hard line" stance on drugs to keep getting elected over and over again by those who believe it is their religious duty to regulate everyone else's bad habits through legislation.

Where does it end? Are we to regulate gluttony? If so I have a feeling that 90% of the politicians and the religious political zealots would quickly find themselves on the wrong side of the law.

What people do in their own homes (to themselves) is NONE OF OUR BUSINESS.

It's time to get rid of the entire bunch of losers who have spent their lives doing nothing more productive than running for office over and over again.

It's time to stand up for our rights as citizens and get the government out of our houses and out of our pursuit of happiness. (no matter how misguided that pursuit may be)
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You want it both Ways Tony...Sorry this aint fairytail land.
 
Ron Musgraves said:
You want it both Ways Tony...Sorry this aint fairytail land.
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You must have me confused with someone else. How do I want it both ways? I think I'm pretty consistent in my views.

Seatbelts - Nobody's business (NB)
Behind closed doors sex between consenting adults (NB)
Drugs in a private home (NB)
Pornography in a private home (NB)
Alcohol (NB)
Tobacco (NB)


On the other hand the following crimes physically or financially hurt others(really hurt, not just a "perceived" or "unmeasurable" hurt resulting in a loss of Liberty for the victim:

Rape
Murder
Assault
Kidnapping
ABORTION
Robbery
etc.

How am I trying to have it both ways?
 
So it does not effect anyone if they have poor health and end up on public assistance, via Social Security, or medicaid that is paid for through tax dollars? I would beg to differ. How about a kid that thinks that the lawless behaviors that often accompany drug usage, such as theft, rape and murder, are a normal paradigm? Do you think that their potential jail terms might effect you or me, through higher taxes? You MIGHT be able to make a case that crime would go down if drugs were legalized, but the health care ramifications would be indisputable.
That being said, I am not sure that I am in favor of how or why this was accomplished, but I do think that there are potential problems that are not being looked at from the correct perspective. Of course, using my same logic, I would not mind outlawing alcohol and cigarettes, because of their potential societal costs. It sure would not effect me. Can you imagine how many low level wage earners, say under $30k a year would be able to more fully support themselves if they did not have a cigarette or alcohol addiction? The reduction in health care, vehicle accidents, and alcohol induced depression are all things that anyone that pays taxes has to deal with. Now with the health care bill, it is goingt o become even more expensive for us, and more regulated. Welcome to 1984, only 26 years late.
 
Scott Stone said:
So it does not effect anyone if they have poor health and end up on public assistance, via Social Security, or medicaid that is paid for through tax dollars? I would beg to differ.

Very simple Scott, I'm not suggesting the promotion of those activities. Paying someone out of tax dollars to keep a sedentary lifestyle is unacceptable. What about smokers? What if they buy their cigarettes with social security money? Drinkers? What about fat a**es that fill their carts up with $300 worth of junk food every week with food stamps?

There is only one way to fix abuse of the system and that is to get rid of the unconstitutional federal government handout programs and leave charity to the individuals.

How about a kid that thinks that the lawless behaviors that often accompany drug usage, such as theft, rape and murder, are a normal paradigm? Do you think that their potential jail terms might effect you or me, through higher taxes? You MIGHT be able to make a case that crime would go down if drugs were legalized, but the health care ramifications would be indisputable.

How do we know this? It that what has happened in the other countries that have legalized drugs? What happened during prohibition? The same arguments were made that you are making now were made then. Yet, prohibition made fortunes for criminals and was a turning point for violence in our country. You can't legislate morality Scott. That's why government should be small and it's goal should be to protect it's innocent citizens from real harm from the ruthless.

That being said, I am not sure that I am in favor of how or why this was accomplished, but I do think that there are potential problems that are not being looked at from the correct perspective. Of course, using my same logic, I would not mind outlawing alcohol and cigarettes, because of their potential societal costs. It sure would not effect me. Can you imagine how many low level wage earners, say under $30k a year would be able to more fully support themselves if they did not have a cigarette or alcohol addiction? The reduction in health care, vehicle accidents, and alcohol induced depression are all things that anyone that pays taxes has to deal with. Now with the health care bill, it is goingt o become even more expensive for us, and more regulated. Welcome to 1984, only 26 years late.

It's already affecting you. You have to pay for these thugs to waste time in elaborate sting operations for pot and prostitutes when our money could be put to much better use patrolling for real crimes.
The ability for in individual to become inebriated goes back to the time of Noah. Even God didn't legislate that right away from his chosen people unless there's an 11th commandment I don't know about. And as far as the low level wager earners argument goes, Scott, some people have an inward desire to punish themselves financially for some reason. If they aren't doing it by throwing money away on smokes and alcohol they will certainly find another way to do so.
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See notes in blue above.
 
Alexy said:
If he was selling weed and coke would it make a diffrence ? would you want to live next to him?
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I probably already do. Ted Binion (former owner of Binion's horsehoe) lived 1 1/2 blocks from me. His heroin dealer lived right across the street. No one ever had a clue.

They just busted a meth operation 5 houses down. Even the next door neighbor knew nothing about it.

It's none of our business. If it was legal there wouldn't be any draw for the criminal element. If prohibition didn't teach us anything it should have at least taught us that.

Think about this. It used to be illegal to have gay sex in one's own home in private. It was illegal in every single state.
Since those laws are no longer enforced has that caused an explosion in people turning "gay"?
They are more vocal now because they don't have to be afraid of arrest anymore, but the number of gays remains about the same.
The law didn't stop anyone from being "gay", it just stopped them from practicing certain acts in their own homes out of fear.

The laws against drugs have the same effect. They take people who are already having problems and turn them into Lawbreakers on top of all their other problems.

The answers to drug abuse and any other "vice" you can think of doesn't lie in enforcment, it lies in empowerment. When people are empowered to make the RIGHT decisions they will. Where does that empowerment come from? I know the answer to that, but that's a whole 'nuther can of worms.

I guess I'm just crazy for thinking that we should have the right to make our own decisions without a government babysitter.
 
The "war on drugs" is the biggest farce I've experienced in my lifetime (except for Obama). It's been a failure since day one, cost the American taxpayers BILLIONS of dollars. It's been used as a political tool, by both parties.

Making cigarettes and alcohol illegal would only create yet another black market opportunity that I'm sure the Cartels would really appreciate.
 
You are all right. I was just pointing out holes in arguments. In all reality, these things are all outside of the constitutional responsibilities of the federal government.
 
Whew, glad for that quick turnaround Scott. Interesting thing - when alcohol was outlawed --- they had to amend the constitution to do it!! They realized that there was no freakin way they could pass a 'law' outlawing it.
 
Also look at all the bad alcohol was made when they outlawed alcohol now look at the drugs bad drugs that are being made in sheds and garages that are killing people. So by outlawing something make people want even more they will try make it or buy from some shady person on the street.
 
tomtucson said:
Whew, glad for that quick turnaround Scott. Interesting thing - when alcohol was outlawed --- they had to amend the constitution to do it!! They realized that there was no freakin way they could pass a 'law' outlawing it.
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Not a turn around, just being argumentative. Sometimes we often do not look at the full ramifications of any argument that is presented.

[rant on]For instance, there are a few people that are fully supportive of health care. They are not stopping to think, or else do not care, that it is going to increase taxes, particularly on those they like to consider wealthy. When that happens, as we all know, it kills the profit motive, and people either stop doing the work that is needed to earn that kind of income, thus reducing employment, or come up with every legal, or nearly legal, tax dodge to avoid paying the taxes that are being imposed. That causes a HUGE downward spiral in revenues collected, and thus requires a logical tax increase, so taxes become even more burdensome on those that make an effort to be as honest as possible in paying their tax assessment. That is why people who look for every possible loophole tick me off. I pay my honest taxes, yet, people that claim more than me pay so little in taxes that they can qualify for food stamps, and then brag about it. I just don't think that is honest, yes, there are standard deductions, but when I have seen someone buy a stroller for their kid, then claim it as a deduction as a work cart, I see stars. [/rant]
 
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